<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The Housing Crisis Is Over (Ha!)</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/</link>
	<description>Macro Perspective on the Capital Markets, Economy, Geopolitics, Technology, and Digital Media</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 11:47:29 -0500</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Mark E Hoffer</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125108</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark E Hoffer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 23:49:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125108</guid>
		<description>this:  babycondor Says: 

November 8th, 2008 at 11:44 am 
From Wikipedia:

“Biggs is author of the 2008 book Wealth, War and Wisdom (358 pages; Wiley; January 2008; ISBN: 978-0-470-22307-9). In this book, Biggs has a gloomy outlook for the economic future, and suggests that investors take survivalist measures such as looking into “polar cities” as safe refuges for future survivors of global warming. In the book, Biggs recommends that his readers should “assume the possibility of a breakdown of the civilized infrastructure.” He goes so far as to recommend planning adaptation strategies now and setting up survival retreats: “Your safe haven must be self-sufficient and capable of growing some kind of food,” Mr. Biggs writes. “It should be well-stocked with seed, fertilizer, canned food, wine, medicine, clothes, etc. Think Swiss Family Robinson. Even in America and Europe there could be moments of riot and rebellion when law and order temporarily completely breaks down.””

needs to be understood.  That, by Biggs, and, even, Barron&#039;s&#039; coverage of &#039;Home Compounds&#039;, received little, to no attention.  Both pieces were, well, previous to the recent the waterfall toward &#039;003 lows..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this:  babycondor Says: </p>
<p>November 8th, 2008 at 11:44 am<br />
From Wikipedia:</p>
<p>“Biggs is author of the 2008 book Wealth, War and Wisdom (358 pages; Wiley; January 2008; ISBN: 978-0-470-22307-9). In this book, Biggs has a gloomy outlook for the economic future, and suggests that investors take survivalist measures such as looking into “polar cities” as safe refuges for future survivors of global warming. In the book, Biggs recommends that his readers should “assume the possibility of a breakdown of the civilized infrastructure.” He goes so far as to recommend planning adaptation strategies now and setting up survival retreats: “Your safe haven must be self-sufficient and capable of growing some kind of food,” Mr. Biggs writes. “It should be well-stocked with seed, fertilizer, canned food, wine, medicine, clothes, etc. Think Swiss Family Robinson. Even in America and Europe there could be moments of riot and rebellion when law and order temporarily completely breaks down.””</p>
<p>needs to be understood.  That, by Biggs, and, even, Barron&#8217;s&#8217; coverage of &#8216;Home Compounds&#8217;, received little, to no attention.  Both pieces were, well, previous to the recent the waterfall toward &#8216;003 lows..</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mike in Nola</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125103</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike in Nola</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 22:44:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125103</guid>
		<description>So how can they still be in business? Maybe these were just head fakes to get the competition to destroy themselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So how can they still be in business? Maybe these were just head fakes to get the competition to destroy themselves.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: AGG</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125096</link>
		<dc:creator>AGG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 21:19:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125096</guid>
		<description>Sorry about the typos. I hurry too much sometimes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry about the typos. I hurry too much sometimes.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: AGG</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125095</link>
		<dc:creator>AGG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 21:17:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125095</guid>
		<description>What caused all this mess?
Take your pick of the HENIOUS HOODLUMS:
1)  Dower 30
2) Nausea 100
3) Snide &amp; Pushy 500
4) Playing Folotsy 100
5) Russler 2000
6) Knock Up Nikky 100
7) Fifty Two fuck up deck.
THESE ARE PEOPLE, NOT STOCKS. They&#039;re still out there. They still have all the capital they stole from us. We can get the money (a lot of it) back.
Hey Barry, why don&#039;t you rotate mug shots with links to damning bios of the culprits through your  web page screens? It might increase you exposure and ad revenue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What caused all this mess?<br />
Take your pick of the HENIOUS HOODLUMS:<br />
1)  Dower 30<br />
2) Nausea 100<br />
3) Snide &amp; Pushy 500<br />
4) Playing Folotsy 100<br />
5) Russler 2000<br />
6) Knock Up Nikky 100<br />
7) Fifty Two fuck up deck.<br />
THESE ARE PEOPLE, NOT STOCKS. They&#8217;re still out there. They still have all the capital they stole from us. We can get the money (a lot of it) back.<br />
Hey Barry, why don&#8217;t you rotate mug shots with links to damning bios of the culprits through your  web page screens? It might increase you exposure and ad revenue.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Pat G.</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125082</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat G.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 18:51:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125082</guid>
		<description>&quot;All these “plans” to keep people in their homes are designed for one purpose only: to retard the fall of home prices, not to save homeowners but to try to salvage poor investment decisions.&quot;

Spot on!  With future ARMs resetting and all the forthcoming layoffs producing more foreclosures how can anyone with half a brain declare the &quot;housing crisis over&quot;.  Oh, we&#039;re talking about Biggs.  Isn&#039;t he in his 80s?  Must be the onset of Alzheimer&#039;s.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;All these “plans” to keep people in their homes are designed for one purpose only: to retard the fall of home prices, not to save homeowners but to try to salvage poor investment decisions.&#8221;</p>
<p>Spot on!  With future ARMs resetting and all the forthcoming layoffs producing more foreclosures how can anyone with half a brain declare the &#8220;housing crisis over&#8221;.  Oh, we&#8217;re talking about Biggs.  Isn&#8217;t he in his 80s?  Must be the onset of Alzheimer&#8217;s.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: redfishmark</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125081</link>
		<dc:creator>redfishmark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 18:41:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125081</guid>
		<description>@Jay – very appropriate questions.  Please let me respond with an example.  We have a data client who is a single family investor who typically purchases SFH at median market value -30% to -40%.    

(BTW - In a given market we track single family home issues by a variety of metrics, and agree with those who have opined in this blog and other places that use of median market home prices can be very, very misleading.)  

That said, we track single family home prices by price bands, and can identify markets for our investor above where homes in the bands from median to median -30% are now increasing in price  – when that happens we’d consider those valuations to  have “bottomed”.  In that same west coast market, however, homes above median price are still dropping in value, and homes at 2-3x median are dropping at even more significant rates.   

Has the overall housing market in that community “bottomed”? – No.  Can prices still fall in that market and things get worse? – Yes, for homes priced at 2x or more above the median there are likely some very ugly days ahead.  Can the increasing prices / valuations in the median to median -30% price bands be derailed by credit issues / other future factors? – Sure they can, but that’s part of what makes the game interesting, isn’t it?   

From our somewhat concrete perspective – you really can’t call “the bottom” until you see consistent upticks in housing unit valuation in a particular target price band.  When I used the term “turning” in my post above, I was referencing the beginning of price stabilization / increases in some price bands (and did not explain that at all in my post).  

What we’re seeing in many communities with more healthy housing markets is that the stabilization in price / valuation typically (not always) starts in price bands near the median and below, and then moves upward into more expensive price bands.  That premise hasn’t held as well in some Texas markets (Houston and Fort Worth in particular), though they didn’t “bubble” near as impressively as many other markets around the country.  

Finally – housing market recovery will be dependent upon much, much more than price alone.  We’re trying to address that by measuring a host of factors for individual markets – including key demographics, job growth and unemployment, economic development measures, as well as rental market and single family metrics.  We have a free index (the Homeowners’ Market Fundamentals Index) ranking markets for homeowners available at http://redfishemergingmarkets.com/pages/hmfi.html.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Jay – very appropriate questions.  Please let me respond with an example.  We have a data client who is a single family investor who typically purchases SFH at median market value -30% to -40%.    </p>
<p>(BTW &#8211; In a given market we track single family home issues by a variety of metrics, and agree with those who have opined in this blog and other places that use of median market home prices can be very, very misleading.)  </p>
<p>That said, we track single family home prices by price bands, and can identify markets for our investor above where homes in the bands from median to median -30% are now increasing in price  – when that happens we’d consider those valuations to  have “bottomed”.  In that same west coast market, however, homes above median price are still dropping in value, and homes at 2-3x median are dropping at even more significant rates.   </p>
<p>Has the overall housing market in that community “bottomed”? – No.  Can prices still fall in that market and things get worse? – Yes, for homes priced at 2x or more above the median there are likely some very ugly days ahead.  Can the increasing prices / valuations in the median to median -30% price bands be derailed by credit issues / other future factors? – Sure they can, but that’s part of what makes the game interesting, isn’t it?   </p>
<p>From our somewhat concrete perspective – you really can’t call “the bottom” until you see consistent upticks in housing unit valuation in a particular target price band.  When I used the term “turning” in my post above, I was referencing the beginning of price stabilization / increases in some price bands (and did not explain that at all in my post).  </p>
<p>What we’re seeing in many communities with more healthy housing markets is that the stabilization in price / valuation typically (not always) starts in price bands near the median and below, and then moves upward into more expensive price bands.  That premise hasn’t held as well in some Texas markets (Houston and Fort Worth in particular), though they didn’t “bubble” near as impressively as many other markets around the country.  </p>
<p>Finally – housing market recovery will be dependent upon much, much more than price alone.  We’re trying to address that by measuring a host of factors for individual markets – including key demographics, job growth and unemployment, economic development measures, as well as rental market and single family metrics.  We have a free index (the Homeowners’ Market Fundamentals Index) ranking markets for homeowners available at <a href="http://redfishemergingmarkets.com/pages/hmfi.html." rel="nofollow">http://redfishemergingmarkets.com/pages/hmfi.html.</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DL</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125073</link>
		<dc:creator>DL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 17:23:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125073</guid>
		<description>In November of 2007, very close to the peak of the stock market,  Barton  Biggs went on CNBC and confidently proclaimed that we were going to see a “melt up” in the stock market, i.e., a HUGE rally.    

How wrong he was.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In November of 2007, very close to the peak of the stock market,  Barton  Biggs went on CNBC and confidently proclaimed that we were going to see a “melt up” in the stock market, i.e., a HUGE rally.    </p>
<p>How wrong he was.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: harold hecuba</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125072</link>
		<dc:creator>harold hecuba</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 17:06:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125072</guid>
		<description>BR. mr. mauldin this week makes similar analogies  of the repulsive housing call  with the geniuses and their call of comparing this recession to the rest of the post ww11 recessions.  it is simply unfathomable to me how these idiots are paid so much money for such worthless advice. wall street will be gutted to the bone before this is all over.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BR. mr. mauldin this week makes similar analogies  of the repulsive housing call  with the geniuses and their call of comparing this recession to the rest of the post ww11 recessions.  it is simply unfathomable to me how these idiots are paid so much money for such worthless advice. wall street will be gutted to the bone before this is all over.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Winston Munn</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125071</link>
		<dc:creator>Winston Munn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 17:03:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125071</guid>
		<description>Herein lies the heart of the affordability problem.

AP
Rich Poor Gap Widens

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/national/20081022_Rich_poor_gap_widens_in_U_S_.html

Is it a coincidence that this study is of the last 20 years, about the same timeframe the U.S. evolved from a manufacturing-based economy into a service-based FIRE economy?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Herein lies the heart of the affordability problem.</p>
<p>AP<br />
Rich Poor Gap Widens</p>
<p><a href="http://www.philly.com/dailynews/national/20081022_Rich_poor_gap_widens_in_U_S_.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.philly.com/dailynews/national/20081022_Rich_poor_gap_widens_in_U_S_.html</a></p>
<p>Is it a coincidence that this study is of the last 20 years, about the same timeframe the U.S. evolved from a manufacturing-based economy into a service-based FIRE economy?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Barry Ritholtz</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/the-housing-crisis-is-over/comment-page-1/#comment-125070</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry Ritholtz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 17:00:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=8506#comment-125070</guid>
		<description>See these for future NBER prononuncments:

http://www.nber.org/cycles.html
http://www.nber.org/new.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>See these for future NBER prononuncments:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nber.org/cycles.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nber.org/cycles.html</a><br />
<a href="http://www.nber.org/new.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nber.org/new.html</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
