Comments on: How to Pay for National Health Insurance http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/ Macro Perspective on the Capital Markets, Economy, Geopolitics, Technology, and Digital Media Tue, 14 Feb 2012 23:28:32 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.5 By: deflv http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-140867 deflv Thu, 22 Jan 2009 12:14:53 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-140867 President Obama and his team are fully aware of the very difficult economic and financial challenges that the country is facing and will work hard to resolve them. I'll see that his staff see this :-) President Obama and his team are fully aware of the very difficult economic and financial challenges that the country is facing and will work hard to resolve them. I’ll see that his staff see this :-)

]]> By: DeDude http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131737 DeDude Tue, 09 Dec 2008 15:36:42 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131737 DL; I for one would not bare my a$$ for an extra tetanus shoot just because it is free :-) Pkut; in what way is “our current system superior to any socialized system”? Is it all the people in our country that goes bankrupt because of health care costs. All the mentally ill who cannot figure out how to navigate the system and fill out forms, and end up on the street without help? Or is it all the low income people that end up having to choose between medicine or food, and end up in the emergency room because of it? Or is it the 20% of all health care cost that we use to hire insurance companies and doctor’s office administrators to fight each other to avoid covering the cost for proper care for patients? The fact is that France pays a lot less for a health care system that by any reasonable performance measure is doing a lot better than ours. Although if you want to do facts Cato-style you can find a few little procedures (out of hundreds) where we barely manage to be better than the frogs. The same goes for waiting times for certain non-essential procedures (particularly those that produce fat profits for the provider). You may be able to find (Cato-style) a few select European countries that are worse than us on that. DL; I for one would not bare my a$$ for an extra tetanus shoot just because it is free :-)

Pkut; in what way is “our current system superior to any socialized system”? Is it all the people in our country that goes bankrupt because of health care costs. All the mentally ill who cannot figure out how to navigate the system and fill out forms, and end up on the street without help? Or is it all the low income people that end up having to choose between medicine or food, and end up in the emergency room because of it? Or is it the 20% of all health care cost that we use to hire insurance companies and doctor’s office administrators to fight each other to avoid covering the cost for proper care for patients?

The fact is that France pays a lot less for a health care system that by any reasonable performance measure is doing a lot better than ours. Although if you want to do facts Cato-style you can find a few little procedures (out of hundreds) where we barely manage to be better than the frogs. The same goes for waiting times for certain non-essential procedures (particularly those that produce fat profits for the provider). You may be able to find (Cato-style) a few select European countries that are worse than us on that.

]]> By: Douglas Watts http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131709 Douglas Watts Tue, 09 Dec 2008 08:42:02 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131709 <i>Deficit spending in the amounts necessary to provide national health care will only speed the demise of the nation.</i> As opposed to speeding its demise with no health insurance. Because that is working so well. Deficit spending in the amounts necessary to provide national health care will only speed the demise of the nation.

As opposed to speeding its demise with no health insurance.

Because that is working so well.

]]> By: pkut http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131703 pkut Tue, 09 Dec 2008 05:51:18 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131703 ottovbvs-why does everyone have to have health care? the 40m number cited is a joke. it includes a significant number of illegal immigrants and another lrg percentage of people who choose not to purchase health insurance (i.e. the young). not too mention another chunk who could qualify for medicare/aid but can't be bothered to fill out the forms. why should we get rid our current system which is superior to any socialized system? on that pt, anyone who uses life expectancy as a metric for a measure of a country's health care system hasn't a clue about what they're talking about. Much of what plays into life expectancy has nothing to health care. If you consider the rates of homicide, mva deaths and greater than twice the rates of obesity that the US has compared to europe, japan and canada it's a miracle and tribute to the system that we're the same. If you want to compare systems look at how long it takes you to get imaging studies(mri's, cat scans), waiting times for orthopedic procedures, survival post transplants/bypass surgery, etc. the US is clearly superior in these areas. Since we will never have meaningful tort reform in this country, unlike europe and canada, the cost of "free" health care would be through the roof. just look at what happened in Hawaii this last yr, when all they did was expand schip. ottovbvs-why does everyone have to have health care? the 40m number cited is a joke. it includes a significant number of illegal immigrants and another lrg percentage of people who choose not to purchase health insurance (i.e. the young). not too mention another chunk who could qualify for medicare/aid but can’t be bothered to fill out the forms. why should we get rid our current system which is superior to any socialized system? on that pt, anyone who uses life expectancy as a metric for a measure of a country’s health care system hasn’t a clue about what they’re talking about. Much of what plays into life expectancy has nothing to health care. If you consider the rates of homicide, mva deaths and greater than twice the rates of obesity that the US has compared to europe, japan and canada it’s a miracle and tribute to the system that we’re the same. If you want to compare systems look at how long it takes you to get imaging studies(mri’s, cat scans), waiting times for orthopedic procedures, survival post transplants/bypass surgery, etc. the US is clearly superior in these areas. Since we will never have meaningful tort reform in this country, unlike europe and canada, the cost of “free” health care would be through the roof. just look at what happened in Hawaii this last yr, when all they did was expand schip.

]]> By: bobc7i http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131682 bobc7i Tue, 09 Dec 2008 02:34:43 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131682 How is President Bush's Mission to Mars initiative coming along? According to his January 2004 speech, "no later than 2008" we will be sending robotic missions to the moon to prepare for returning a man to the moon by 2020. I wonder where this ranks on Barack's todo list How is President Bush’s Mission to Mars initiative coming along? According to his January 2004 speech, “no later than 2008″ we will be sending robotic missions to the moon to prepare for returning a man to the moon by 2020. I wonder where this ranks on Barack’s todo list

]]> By: DL http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131627 DL Mon, 08 Dec 2008 21:29:30 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131627 DeDude @ 3:13 “… Kudlow … is so consistently wrong that it must be a miracle…” I would agree that when making stock market or economic predictions, Kudlow has nothing but a total disdain for the truth. (And I hope you're correct about the cost of health care). DeDude @ 3:13

“… Kudlow … is so consistently wrong that it must be a miracle…”

I would agree that when making stock market or economic predictions, Kudlow has nothing but a total disdain for the truth.

(And I hope you’re correct about the cost of health care).

]]> By: DeDude http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131604 DeDude Mon, 08 Dec 2008 20:13:18 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131604 DL; except that it is free in all other industrialized countries and it still cost them a lot less than we pay. I am not suggesting that co-pays should not be a part of the system to encourage responsible use. If Kudlow would be against it it must be great - that man is so consistently wrong that it must be a miracle (it can't be dumb luck). DL; except that it is free in all other industrialized countries and it still cost them a lot less than we pay. I am not suggesting that co-pays should not be a part of the system to encourage responsible use. If Kudlow would be against it it must be great – that man is so consistently wrong that it must be a miracle (it can’t be dumb luck).

]]> By: Bruce N Tennessee http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131599 Bruce N Tennessee Mon, 08 Dec 2008 19:54:43 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131599 There is already a national health system in Canada...annex Canada, send everyone north on vacation (money for Canadians) and while they are there, have their 5 vessel bypass.... very simple... There is already a national health system in Canada…annex Canada, send everyone north on vacation (money for Canadians) and while they are there, have their 5 vessel bypass….

very simple…

]]> By: ottovbvs http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131596 ottovbvs Mon, 08 Dec 2008 19:41:21 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131596 It's certainly a novel approach. One of the things I find interesting about the anti universal healthcare, free market crowd is that they never explain how the fact that the US is paying twice as much as anyone else for a healthcare system that doesn't cover about 17% of the population is actually a demonstration of the efficacy of free markets. Would you pay $60,000 for a $30,000 GM truck that didn't have a back axle? It’s certainly a novel approach. One of the things I find interesting about the anti universal healthcare, free market crowd is that they never explain how the fact that the US is paying twice as much as anyone else for a healthcare system that doesn’t cover about 17% of the population is actually a demonstration of the efficacy of free markets. Would you pay $60,000 for a $30,000 GM truck that didn’t have a back axle?

]]> By: DL http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/how-to-pay-for-national-health-insurance/comment-page-1/#comment-131593 DL Mon, 08 Dec 2008 19:27:27 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=11105#comment-131593 DeDude @ 1:37 “National health insurance does not have to cost a dime. Just take all that money businesses and individuals waste on health care and you have more than enough money”. I’m afraid I’ll have to agree with Larry Kudlow on this one; his comment would likely be the following: “You’ll be surprised how much something can cost when you give it away for free”. It’s a mistake to make “static” assumptions regarding cost. DeDude @ 1:37

“National health insurance does not have to cost a dime. Just take all that money businesses and individuals waste on health care and you have more than enough money”.

I’m afraid I’ll have to agree with Larry Kudlow on this one; his comment would likely be the following:

“You’ll be surprised how much something can cost when you give it away for free”.

It’s a mistake to make “static” assumptions regarding cost.

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