Comments on: Was There Really a Financial Crisis ? http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/ Macro Perspective on the Capital Markets, Economy, Geopolitics, Technology, and Digital Media Sat, 21 Nov 2009 22:27:20 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Greg0658 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135530 Greg0658 Wed, 24 Dec 2008 13:25:38 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135530 Moss Says: "People believe what they want to believe." words ... brainwashing graven images .. and now recordings our species difference ... dexterous hands and more intellect ( said more - not greater ) because I didn't write this 2 days ago .. it'll be slightly different sometimes I wonder if Earth is the Australia to the Universe and maybe 2012 is the return just thinking ... if so - worry Instinct ... Creationism - Evolution - Intelligent Design Moss Says: “People believe what they want to believe.”

words … brainwashing

graven images .. and now recordings
our species difference … dexterous hands and more intellect ( said more – not greater )

because I didn’t write this 2 days ago .. it’ll be slightly different

sometimes I wonder if Earth is the Australia to the Universe
and maybe 2012 is the return
just thinking
… if so – worry

Instinct … Creationism – Evolution – Intelligent Design

]]> By: Pat G. http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135268 Pat G. Tue, 23 Dec 2008 01:14:39 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135268 Credit crisis? We've thrown a couple of trillion at it already and has that helped? Financial crisis? The banks were overleveraged in securities they did not comprehend. When the shit hit the fan, they could no longer turn them over because nobody wanted that toxic waste. Not being able to roll it made them use their reserves for day to day operations. That's what they're doing with the TARP money now. And now they want the other $350B. The premise of a credit crisis was used to sway the politicians and the rest of America into bank rolling the financial industry. If it would have truly been a credit crisis than the money would have been better spent giving it directly to the American people. They wouldn't need credit then, right? The credit crisis myth was used to masquerade the financial industry's crisis. This way they can gradually take their writedowns and remain solvent. As an American, I think its horseshit that we now have to beg and plead to the banks for credit when it is our money which is making that money available for credit to begin with. The financial industry gets our money from the FED for toxic waste or 0%, the FED then pays them an interest rate of 3% and then when the banks feel obliged to lend our money back to us they charge 7% or more. Even after trillions of dollars, financial companies have still not come clean with their losses while homeowners with little or no help continue to be foreclosed upon. In other words, with the exception of trillions of our money being spent to bailout executives who make the Big 3's look like rocket sceintists, nothing has changed. This scheme makes Madoff look like a choir boy. Think outside the box next time! Credit crisis? We’ve thrown a couple of trillion at it already and has that helped? Financial crisis? The banks were overleveraged in securities they did not comprehend. When the shit hit the fan, they could no longer turn them over because nobody wanted that toxic waste. Not being able to roll it made them use their reserves for day to day operations. That’s what they’re doing with the TARP money now. And now they want the other $350B. The premise of a credit crisis was used to sway the politicians and the rest of America into bank rolling the financial industry. If it would have truly been a credit crisis than the money would have been better spent giving it directly to the American people. They wouldn’t need credit then, right? The credit crisis myth was used to masquerade the financial industry’s crisis. This way they can gradually take their writedowns and remain solvent. As an American, I think its horseshit that we now have to beg and plead to the banks for credit when it is our money which is making that money available for credit to begin with. The financial industry gets our money from the FED for toxic waste or 0%, the FED then pays them an interest rate of 3% and then when the banks feel obliged to lend our money back to us they charge 7% or more. Even after trillions of dollars, financial companies have still not come clean with their losses while homeowners with little or no help continue to be foreclosed upon. In other words, with the exception of trillions of our money being spent to bailout executives who make the Big 3’s look like rocket sceintists, nothing has changed. This scheme makes Madoff look like a choir boy. Think outside the box next time!

]]> By: joeblo http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135220 joeblo Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:35:28 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135220 Well yes, we were hoodwinked. It just wasn't by the credit crisis. The credit crisis was even relatively predictable if you read CR, Roubini, or even Krugman. We were hoodwinked by the "regulators" and "bankers" that drove credit issuance ever higher as credit standards plummeted. We were hoodwinked by excess leverage, excess payouts, and excess securitization (without security). The point is, we've already spent the money. It's already been loaned out against projects and collateral which are not worth the money loaned. It has been mis-allocated, misspent, and mal-invested. We have many McMansions, shopping Malls, and luxury Apartment/Hotels. Unfortunately, only the FED will give the banks collateral against this or any other asset backed security. The hoodwinking was done in private (the profits) over the last 10 years, only the bailout is public (the losses). Yes, the banks (their executives and investors) should probably pay a higher price, but ultimately the game has been played so that it can only be paid in full by society as a whole. That was the plan! Well yes, we were hoodwinked. It just wasn’t by the credit crisis. The credit crisis was even relatively predictable if you read CR, Roubini, or even Krugman. We were hoodwinked by the “regulators” and “bankers” that drove credit issuance ever higher as credit standards plummeted. We were hoodwinked by excess leverage, excess payouts, and excess securitization (without security).

The point is, we’ve already spent the money. It’s already been loaned out against projects and collateral which are not worth the money loaned. It has been mis-allocated, misspent, and mal-invested. We have many McMansions, shopping Malls, and luxury Apartment/Hotels. Unfortunately, only the FED will give the banks collateral against this or any other asset backed security.

The hoodwinking was done in private (the profits) over the last 10 years, only the bailout is public (the losses). Yes, the banks (their executives and investors) should probably pay a higher price, but ultimately the game has been played so that it can only be paid in full by society as a whole. That was the plan!

]]> By: danm http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135202 danm Mon, 22 Dec 2008 18:05:38 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135202 Just like the overweight middle aged women who thinks she looks good in a bikini and subsequently wears it to the beach much to the disbelief of everyone else. ---- Maybe she just likes grossing people out. Like you said we believe what we want to believe when we want to believe it. Just like the overweight middle aged women who thinks she looks good in a bikini and subsequently wears it to the beach much to the disbelief of everyone else.
—-
Maybe she just likes grossing people out.

Like you said we believe what we want to believe when we want to believe it.

]]> By: Moss http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135192 Moss Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:07:44 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135192 People believe what they want to believe. Just like the overweight middle aged women who thinks she looks good in a bikini and subsequently wears it to the beach much to the disbelief of everyone else. People believe what they want to believe. Just like the overweight middle aged women who thinks she looks good in a bikini and subsequently wears it to the beach much to the disbelief of everyone else.

]]> By: Greg0658 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135185 Greg0658 Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:27:41 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135185 Was There Really a Financial Crisis? - short answer is yes who what where when why how - it got started? interesting comments so far and initial concept from MN Res who > common workers what > struggling to maintain dream post global resurgance where > in America when > post Enron, WorldCom, Heathcare South, Tyco, 9/11 & the Shock and Awe why > oil and MIC rules how > paid for war with MEW who > bulls & bears what > need a market to make a trade in where > 3 financial capitals of the world when > every weekday why > daily bread is needed for industry to live (buy and sell are the bullets of this war) how > chat, ads, hype who > me ... & maybe you what > the 3rd machine print cache quick drop where > NYSE when > Mar 4th 2007 (there abouts) why > lots of sales volume how > chat Was There Really a Financial Crisis? – short answer is yes

who what where when why how – it got started?
interesting comments so far and initial concept from MN Res

who > common workers
what > struggling to maintain dream post global resurgance
where > in America
when > post Enron, WorldCom, Heathcare South, Tyco, 9/11 & the Shock and Awe
why > oil and MIC rules
how > paid for war with MEW

who > bulls & bears
what > need a market to make a trade in
where > 3 financial capitals of the world
when > every weekday
why > daily bread is needed for industry to live
(buy and sell are the bullets of this war)
how > chat, ads, hype

who > me … & maybe you
what > the 3rd machine print cache quick drop
where > NYSE
when > Mar 4th 2007 (there abouts)
why > lots of sales volume
how > chat

]]> By: Texican http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135177 Texican Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:53:52 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135177 My experience during my 10 years spent in a Minnesota gulag was that every "official" pronouncement was driven more by ideology than it was any basis in fact. I suspect that is the case here. Many Minnesotans are suffering from a serious disconnect with reality. The others are trapped in a gulag that we used to refer to as Moscow on the Mississippi, but of course Moscow has proven itself to be far more resilient and open to new ideas than it's red sister in the grain belt. My experience during my 10 years spent in a Minnesota gulag was that every “official” pronouncement was driven more by ideology than it was any basis in fact. I suspect that is the case here. Many Minnesotans are suffering from a serious disconnect with reality. The others are trapped in a gulag that we used to refer to as Moscow on the Mississippi, but of course Moscow has proven itself to be far more resilient and open to new ideas than it’s red sister in the grain belt.

]]> By: grumpyoldvet http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135168 grumpyoldvet Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:54:09 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135168 H.L. Mencken said it best about America And here, more than anywhere else I know of or have heard of, the daily panorama of human existence, or private and communal folly--the unending procession of governmental extortions and chicaneries, of commercial brigandages and throat-slittings, of theological buffooneries, of aesthetic ribaldries, of legal swindles and harlotries, of miscellaneous rogueries, villainies, imbecilities, grotesqueries, and extravagances--is so inordinately gross and preposterous, so perfectly brought up to the highest conceivable amperage, so steadily enriched with an almost fabulous daring and originality, that only the man who was born with a petrified diaphragm can fail to laugh himself to sleep every night, and to awake every morning with all the eager, unflagging expectation of a Sunday-school superintendent touring the Paris peep-shows. And that was in 1922. Things never do change do they. H.L. Mencken said it best about America

And here, more than anywhere else I know of or have heard of, the daily panorama of human existence, or private and communal folly–the unending procession of governmental extortions and chicaneries, of commercial brigandages and throat-slittings, of theological buffooneries, of aesthetic ribaldries, of legal swindles and harlotries, of miscellaneous rogueries, villainies, imbecilities, grotesqueries, and extravagances–is so inordinately gross and preposterous, so perfectly brought up to the highest conceivable amperage, so steadily enriched with an almost fabulous daring and originality, that only the man who was born with a petrified diaphragm can fail to laugh himself to sleep every night, and to awake every morning with all the eager, unflagging expectation of a Sunday-school superintendent touring the Paris peep-shows.

And that was in 1922. Things never do change do they.

]]> By: Bruce N Tennessee http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135167 Bruce N Tennessee Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:50:15 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135167 Will there be a financial crisis? This is more along the lines of what a thinker might have envisioned in 2005...and it is rather fascinating.. http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200507/fallows Countdown to a Meltdown. The Atlantic July 2005. Will there be a financial crisis?

This is more along the lines of what a thinker might have envisioned in 2005…and it is rather fascinating..

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200507/fallows

Countdown to a Meltdown.

The Atlantic July 2005.

]]> By: danm http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/was-there-really-a-financial-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-135160 danm Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:03:09 +0000 http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=13371#comment-135160 I think this is testament to the fact that we won't be getting out of our predicament using logic and truth. The winners will be those who best influence those with power. I think this is testament to the fact that we won’t be getting out of our predicament using logic and truth.

The winners will be those who best influence those with power.

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