Yes, we don’t want to harm (heh heh) the finance sector:

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Via Matt Davies

Category: Markets

Please use the comments to demonstrate your own ignorance, unfamiliarity with empirical data and lack of respect for scientific knowledge. Be sure to create straw men and argue against things I have neither said nor implied. If you could repeat previously discredited memes or steer the conversation into irrelevant, off topic discussions, it would be appreciated. Lastly, kindly forgo all civility in your discourse . . . you are, after all, anonymous.

53 Responses to “The Harm of Nationalization . . .”

  1. Bruce in Tn says:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aGbSx7rY_DYU&refer=worldwide

    Merrill Says It Discovered Trading ‘Irregularity’ (Update2)

    This should help B of A Monday…

    (I think prunes are good for irregulaity…)

  2. Kyle says:

    It’s interesting how the banks have done to themselves (and our economy) what Al Qaeda was trying but failing to do all along….

  3. VennData says:

    At the highest level macro picture, the political economy is doing what needs to be done: that is, making sure these “venerable” institutions are no longer too big to fail.

  4. DL says:

    I heard one pundit say that these companies have “wonderful global franchises”, and that it “would be a shame” to force them to downsize.

    Translation: let’s give the royal screw to the taxpayers so that no one has to sell anything.

    It’s amazing how many politically connected people agree with such nonsense.

  5. SINGER says:

    Massive Bounce Into The Close…

  6. dead hobo says:

    Bruce In Tn,

    Re: The Bloomberg story to linked to

    Here’s the parts I like

    “March 6 (Bloomberg) — Merrill Lynch & Co., the securities firm acquired by Bank of America Corp., said it uncovered an “irregularity” during a review of its trading operations. ”

    “Merrill Lynch may have lost hundreds of millions of dollars on currency trading and credit derivatives last year, the New York Times reported earlier today. The losses did not “spill into plain view” until after Bank of America investors had approved the $33 billion takeover in December and Merrill Lynch disbursed $3.6 billion in bonuses to bankers, the newspaper said”

    So, is this sensational reporting or magnificent fraud? Somebody need to have their nuts cut off over this. Publicly. Televised on the internet. And they have to watch as their gender changes right before their eyes. And a laugh track must be inserted into the video. And, not to be a sexist, if said offender is female, said babe(s) should be sent to the Far East to work on her (their) knees for punishment and caloric sustenance. Then again, why be sexist. The men can go to the Far East and do ladies work if they prefer and can manage 2000 calories a day from their labors.

    I’m getting sick of these fuck*ng crooks.

  7. Lunch Meat says:

    It’s pretty clear from the kind of behavior detailed in news stories like this that awful lot of people in the financial sector have no concern whatsoever with the rest of the country. If that isn’t unpatriotic, perhaps sociopathic behavior, I don’t know what is.

  8. dead hobo says:

    Lunch Meat Said:
    March 6th, 2009 at 5:08 pm

    It’s pretty clear from the kind of behavior detailed in news stories like this that awful lot of people in the financial sector have no concern whatsoever with the rest of the country. If that isn’t unpatriotic, perhaps sociopathic behavior, I don’t know what is.

    reply:

    Osama Bin Laden doesn’t have to do crap. Wall Street has done it for him. And the Republicans supported much of it until voters had their say. What a bunch of patriotic retards. And now they fight all efforts to fix the problems they created. These goofballs belong in Gitmo. They’ve done their master’s work for him.

  9. DL says:

    Bruce in Tn @ 4:35

    Add another euphemism to the Wall Street lexicon: “trading irregularity”.

    Just like there’s no such thing as a “bear market” or a selling avalanche; it’s just “repricing of risk”.

    And there’s no such thing as selling a stock; its just “profit taking”.

  10. dps says:

    As of lately I’ve been getting this sick feeling that if nationalization were to occur then we might be privy to some very, very scary and unbelievable things that have been done in the financial world. I mean if these guys can give themselves multimillion dollar bonuses, in plain view, while losing billions, what did they do when they thought no one was looking and never would? Timmy and his friends may have decided we can’t handle the truth – figuratively and literally. I mean take your worst thoughts and scenarios and now consider them optimistic.
    I’m starting to look at property in South America – GWB got about a million acres in Paraguay for some unknown(?) reason. He always seems to come out okay, no matter how bad he screws up.

  11. Foghorn Longhorn says:

    The Capitalist Limo now looks like the Beverly Hills jalopy.
    Shakily running down the road, bouncing from bar ditch to bar ditch.
    Three tires flat, just on one side of course, have to remain optimistic, the lug nuts flying off the fourth.
    Huge black puffs of smoke billowing from beneath the hood.
    Anybody that tried to repair it, thrown underneath its shaky chassis.
    How much further can it sputter?

  12. Mannwich says:

    It’s not socialism, it’s sociopathism.

  13. Mannwich says:

    Welcome to sociopathism.

  14. dead hobo says:

    Somebody with the power to do something needs to show some f*cking outrage and make these crooks and thieves hire lawyers with their own money to defend themselves in criminal and civil court. The civil lawyers need to use their particular skills at torture and put these bastards in their places.

    On a secondary topic, I read Steve Forbes piece in the WSJ this morning. I’m glad he saw fit to change hats now that the leadership in the country has changed. About Mark to Market, I somewhat agree. There must be a way to value assets with cash flow, but no market for resale, based on the discounted value of the cash flows less a reasonable default rate applied towards future cash flows. How would this approach improve the capital base of financial institutions? If this approach is allowed and in use, then My bad. Nevermind. If not, then the pointy headed FASB deep thinkers in charge should fix this.

  15. Mannwich says:

    @dps: Bingo. The court systems and prisons can’t handle all of the criminals that would have to be prosecuted and imprisoned and we won’t like what we see behind the curtain. I think deep down most thinking people are uneasy right now for this very reason.

  16. Foghorn Longhorn says:

    dps,
    Timmy and his friends may have decided we can’t handle the truth – figuratively and literally. I mean take your worst thoughts and scenarios and now consider them optimistic.

    WE can handle the truth, THEY can’t handle the truth.

  17. Mannwich says:

    @Foghorn: Correction: THEY can’t handle US knowing the truth. They know it would be pitchforks time.

  18. leftback says:

    Speaking of pitchforks, we may be getting close to some big-time perp walks. Boy, do we need them!!

    http://mortgage.freedomblogging.com/2009/03/05/sec-closing-in-on-mozilo-article-says/7605/

  19. constantnormal says:

    @ DL — you will appreciate today’s Cassandra Does Tokyo item on “quantitative easing”

  20. willid3 says:

    I am not convinced that removing MTM will do any thing other than doom those companies that were required to do it. after all, if nobody can trust their numbers now with it, how much better will they feel if they don’t have to value them at all? if the banks had bought these mortgages as mortgages not as securities (meaning they were not bundled or sliced and diced by the wizards of wall street) then you might get some traction to valuing them that way, but then the banks would have to keep them on their books for almost the life of the contract to make that a valid methodology. but as securities, they get values by that market some are so enamored by. isn’t that what they are so proud of, the markets ability to set values to these sort of things? unless it of course it doesn’t set the value they want it to

  21. Foghorn Longhorn says:

    Mannwich,
    Have you not looked across the cubicle or across the street, first off, we would have to have China manufacture and send over a boatload.
    Second, we would have to teach the masses how to grasp their sweaty little fingers around the handle and lastly, teach them which end is the business end.
    Then actually gather them (have you ever herded cats) and with some sort of order descend upon DC.
    Upon arriving we would have to brave an onslaught of CS gas and rubber (hopefully) bullets.
    Fuck, I don’t even think Gen. Patton is up for this shit.

  22. Mannwich says:

    I hear you, Foghorn but I think the clueless masses are waking up, ever so slowly. It’s a process. Most are still in the shocked denial phase (b…but, it will come back, right?) but when they all wake up and realize the sobering reality of what we’re facing (probably this summer when it’s hot and humid and everyone’s on edge), there will be much ugliness. It’s the calm before the real storm. I don’t mean pitchforks in the literal sense, but definitely ugliness that we haven’t seen since probably the ’60′s.

  23. Mannwich says:

    The capitalists ate capitalism. No confidence + no trust = nowhere. Heckuva a job.

  24. leftback says:

    Not DC, NYC. GS and AIG is where the looting is centered.
    Of course they do have a hot line to Timmy and Ben.

  25. constantnormal says:

    ‘Tis a pity that we are so far away from a major election cycle … but then, I don’t expect things to be much different in 2010.

    My guess is that a lot of Senators and Congressmen will decide to “retire” to become lobbyists rather than face the voters with salvo after salvo of nonsensical crap and blame-storming.

  26. Michel Caldwell says:

    For what it’s worth in humor…
    As a take-off on a current accounting firm ad, how about a picture of some wall street types in Jos. A. Barrel suits saying to each other, “We’re going with BDV.” ???

  27. DeDude says:

    Yes, you know if people who have lost more than 90% of their investment due to incompetent risk-taking CEO’s were to loose the last few pennies to nationalization they would go hopping mad. Such a nationalization would completely destroy those peoples confidence in the capitalist system, and its ability to allow them to make money in the stock market. As long as it is not the government that rob them of the last few pennies they will be salivating about free market capitalism; if it is the government, then they will be hiding under their beds and never come out again. Now the question is whether my country should be hostage to a bunch of idiots claiming they will hide under they bed, or we should just do the right thing and let those idiots rot if they so choose?

  28. wisedup says:

    from Bloomberg http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aG0_2ZIA96TI&refer=home
    “The Fed refused yesterday to disclose the names of the borrowers and the loans, alleging that it would cast “a stigma” on recipients of more than $1.9 trillion of emergency credit from U.S. taxpayers and the assets the central bank is accepting as collateral.”

    Heaven forfend, our money is making them uncomfortable, embarrassed? How unfortunate, well then, given us our money back.

  29. greg says:

    The bottom will be put in when some Howard Beale type literally takes out one of these CEO’s. Surprised it hasn’t happened…yet.

  30. grumpyoldvet says:

    Luskin is on Kudlow’s show again this evening. I wonder if he is so broke that this is only means of support other perhaps an extension of unemployment benefits that he may have recently received. I know, I know, he cen’t be paid & collect unemployment but there are ways.

  31. Foghorn,

    along the line of your point, re: Patton.

    “No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. You win a war by making the other dumb bastard die for his country.”
    - General George S. Patton

    “I would rather have a German division in front of me than a French division behind me.”
    - General George S. Patton

    “Moral Courage is the most valuable and usually the most absent characteristic in men”.
    - General George S. Patton

    A provocative book was penned, towit:
    From the Inside Flap
    He was the most controversial American general in World War II–and also one of the most successful, courageous, and audacious. As a post-war administrator of defeated Germany, he sounded alarm bells about the dangers of Soviet encroachment into Europe. Politically, he was a lightning rod–an outspoken conservative who continually embarrassed his superiors with his uncensored, undiplomatic, and unrestrained comments to the press. He was General George S. Patton Jr., old Blood and Guts.
    In 1945, shortly before he was to fly home to the states as a conquering hero, he was involved in a mysterious car crash that left him partially paralyzed.

    Two weeks later, just as his doctors were about to send him home to finish his recovery, he was dead.
    The army ruled the car crash an accident, his death natural. Yet witness testimony on the crash conflicted, key players in the incident disappeared, official reports vanished, soldiers were ordered to keep silent, and there was no autopsy performed on the body.

    Investigative and military reporter Robert Wilcox, author of Black Aces High and Wings of Fury, has spent more than ten years investigating these mysteries, and in Target: Patton he has written an electrifying account of the shocking circumstances–long hidden from the public–surrounding the death of America’s most famous general. In Target: Patton, you’ll discover:
    http://www.amazon.com/Target-Patton-Assassinate-General-George/dp/1596985798

    seems like we have a strange habit of losing strong leaders, maybe that Trend will change– probably one more important than the SPX’s..

  32. Pat G. says:

    These suckers have already been nationalized with new debt. Not only will the American taxpayer get screwed by the worthless investments we’re buying but.. they also get to pay for the ongoing as well as the future cost of it. And our friendliest of trading partners are pretty much following our lead. If that’s not a recipe for global inflation, nothing is.

  33. wisedup says:

    just a thought for the experts. how the hell can the recipients NOT put these monies on their financial statements?

  34. DiggidyDan says:

    Wonder what JMBorchers thinks. I love today’s quote and think it was added to the queue for some specific reason.

  35. karen says:

    dan, good thot. i often think that about myself. and, as i’ve been trying to trade against the trend recently, it’s been challenging. every now and then, it’s good to try new things, is what i must be thinking. variety, as they say, is the spice of life.

  36. AGG says:

    Folks, accountabilty doesn’t exist for corporation since thet got legal personhood and limited liabiity thanks to the supreme misinterpretation of the fourteenth amendment by the bought and paid for supreme court in the late 19th century. The “corporations” didn’t game the system and steal us blind; Human beings did. Hello Paulson, Fuld, Thain, Andrea Orcel, David Sobotka, Peter Kraus, Thomas Montag, David Gu, David Goodman and Fares Noujaim, et al. Names, people, we need names!

    And this limited liability dodge has got to end or forget about compensation and accountability. Are there any honest judges left in this country?

  37. Andy Tabbo says:

    I love the cartoon. These guys resisted nationalization because of downside consequences….

    The stocks are near Zero. The SP500 was down nearly 60% on it’s lows today. We’re clearly in a Depression. WTF? What else is there to lose? CLEAN THIS SHIT UP!

    Systemic risk? WTF? We’ve got systemic risk…it happened. The system collapsed. It’s over. Our bankers failed. The government failed. The Fed failed. People who borrowed too much failed. The house burned down. It’s time to bring in the Bulldozers and raze this decroded piece of crap….Unfortunately the people who saw it coming and the people who were good citizens/capitalists will have to clean it up and rebuild. It will be costly and painful.

    Ruger and Smith/Wesson are definitely rebounding….it’s an unfortunate “sign.”

    f

  38. karen says:

    As it is friday night, i’ve been trying to find the best link to G. Love’s “Friday Night” song. Unfortunately, it’s a several step process.

    First, click this: http://www.philadelphonic.com/music
    Two, click the last cover on the top row, it reads in tiny red print: G. Love and Special Sauce
    Three, click on song #10

    If you like that one, you’ll love #9.

    And, I would also recommend #4 with Jack Johnson.

  39. DMR says:

    trading irregularity? Is that like a conundrum?

  40. to the ‘toon, seems that the Fed Branches in the mid-west haven’t lost their ability to Reason:

    “Kansas City Fed President and veteran Fed official Thomas Hoenig said:

    Too big has failed….
    The sequence of [the government's] actions, unfortunately, has added to market uncertainty. Investors are understandably watching to see which institutions will receive public money and survive as wards of the state….

    The U.S. Treasury has failed to take “decisive” action to address the bank crisis, pursuing an ad-hoc approach that leaves management in place and avoids necessary asset writedowns….

    Any financial crisis leaves a stream of losses among the various participants, and these losses must ultimately be borne by someone. To start the resolution process, management responsible for the problems must be replaced and the losses identified and taken. Until these actions are taken, there is little chance to restore market confidence and get credit markets flowing. It is not a question of avoiding these losses, but one of how soon we will take them and get on to the process of recovery….

    Many of the [government's current policy revolves around the idea of] “too big to fail” …. History, however, may show us a different experience. When examining previous financial crises, both in other countries as well as the United States, large institutions have been allowed to fail. Banking authorities have been successful in placing new and more responsible managers and directions in charge and then reprivatizing them. There is also evidence suggesting that countries that have tried to avoid taking such steps have been much slower to recover, and the ultimate cost to taxpayers has been larger. …
    http://www.kansascityfed.org/home/subwebnav.cfm?level=3&theID=10033&SubWeb=6

  41. Andy Tabbo says:

    “Too Big Fail” is the biggest Load of Crap ever put on the American Public. That is just such crap.

    Certainly “equity” holders have failed, while the Gov’t has bailed at all the bondholders.

    If you’re too big too fail, you’re too big to exist. Period.

    At some point, Bill Gross and Mushmouth El-Arian will have to take a haircut. I’m so sick of those guys….

    “You need to be under the government umbrella…”

    PIMCO is one of our problems. These guys are essentially front-running the U.S. government on a major level….

    At some point the Gov’t will need to force Pimco to take “a haircut.”

    I know the U.S. government is scared of this sort of stand off….because “who knows what will happen…they (Pimco) will dump all the debt and corporate debt will soar…catastrophic..”

    Really?

    What will Pimco do? Where will they put their money? Ahhhhhhh……..

    They (Pimco and other large bond houses) will have two choices….1) U.S. Long term debt (which would be fine)….or 2) They will be forced to finally take some “risk” and invest in real corporate debt in a big way. (which would be fine as well).

    The endgame should be obvious for the major players….

    Let’s get in on….

    AT

  42. karen says:

    sorry (for the millionth time) and not to piggyback, but one of the worst examples of public speaking imo:

    http://paul.kedrosky.com/archives/2009/03/mohamed_el-eria.html

    also, been disgusted with gross for years… talk about a removed, reclused, yogi, stamp collecting, OC billionaire…

    bot my 22 yr old son El-Erian’s book for Christmas… 2 day’s later, don’t bother, i’ll summarize it for you.

  43. right?

    it’s funny, or is it? CNN can find 90 minutes, on the weekend, to cover “Pills’” “address” to CPAC, though, somehow, a of Hoenig’s?, a full speech of Walker’s? (formerly head of the GAO), nah, time is Scarce, we’ve Cashish to earn, gotta make the ‘vertisers Happy, the Dog eat the satellite feed…

    We’re poorly served by the MSM, we keep it up, we’ll be served, poorly, to those that we allow to keep threatening us from hollow positions–as AT delineates..
    ~~

    karen,

    any more background on those Silver Slippers?

  44. karen says:

    “The slippers will in the end liberate Dorothy but first she must walk in them down the golden yellow brick road, i.e. she must take silver down the path of gold, the path of free coinage. Following the road of gold leads eventually only to the Emerald City, which may symbolize the fraudulent world of greenback paper money that only pretends to have value, or may symbolize the greenback value that is placed on gold (and for silver, possibly).”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_The_Wonderful_Wizard_of_Oz

    I’m actually not this crazy. I’m just anti the central bank/Fed oligarchy. Although, i’m all for them backstopping my bank as i have no debt, live below my means, and have done nothing wrong… other than insult people now and then.

    SORRY, no one appreciated my music offering this evening. Time for me to got to bed…

  45. Andy Tabbo says:

    karen.

    I listened to the GLove….

    It was actually quite great. It was a pretty good fusion of many, many different genres. They sort of remind me of Red Hot Chili Peppers “mellowed” out and probably better.

    I bought the album.

    in re: fading trends….It’s difficult to do… In a previous life I made a living fading major turning points and fought many major trends. I made a lot of money doing it, but it required deep pockets and trading much smaller than you might like. As a lonely and small trader, I’ve learned to not do it so much….

  46. sailorwill says:

    My take on Bank Nationalization:

    1.Why should taxpayers bail out banks?
    For the same reason taxpayers are being asked to bail out underwater homeowners. It is easy to place all of the blame on the banks in the current climate. However, what transpired was not just a housing failure, or banking failure, what happened was a systematic failure of our nation. Government policy of deregulation and loose money supply, coupled with unchecked global capitalism, created an environment where both corporations and individuals took on more risk than they can handle. If any entity deserved the most blame, it is our government. As our government is elected by the citizenry (i.e. taxpayers) in a democracy which most of us subscribe to, we taxpayers are ultimately responsible for paying to fix the problem. The shareholders of these big banks have taken significant haircuts, Most of them bear no more blame than the underwater homeowners. Moreover, Bank of America, Wells Fargo, JP Morgan are in their plight partly due to their working with the government in solving this crisis. As distasteful as Mr Chuck Prince’s quote is now, while the Fed and US government were playing the music of deregulation and loose monetary policy and unbridled capitalism, the banks, the corporations they financed, we citizens as home buyers and consumers (also financed by the banks) kept on dancing. Now that the music has stopped, why should bank shareholders be the ones without a chair? Everybody, starting from the government and its taxpayers, down to banks, corporations, ordinary citizens need to share the responsibility and burden. At last check we still believe in capitalism and want to rely on private capital to help get us out of this mess. Let’s be pragmatic and strike a balance in assisting banks/corporations and individuals. If proven necessary as in Citi, limited government participation in common equity to reap more future upside would seem to be a reasonable compromise.

    2.Haircut to the bondholders.
    Wiping out the shareholders itself doesn’t solve the problem, as evidenced by the continuous flow of government money into Fannie/Freddie and AIG. What Drs. Krugmand and Roubini brush over in a couple of sentences — haircutting the bondholders, writing off the toxic assets, and returning them to private hands, are actually the tough part, and maybe the reason the government has not undertaken them with Fannie/Freddie and AIG. How much a haircut to assign to the various parties in the complex system of derivatives, how to do it in an orderly fashion without causing systematic collapse (i.e. Lehman Brothers)? As our whole country was a debtor nation, it is inevitable much of the haircut eventually will go to creditor nations such as China, Japan, Saudi Arabia, etc, what effect would that have on their economy and their willingness to buy more of our debt now that as a nation we can’t honor our debt. And if we were able to re-privatize these banks quickly like in one year, who would buy them? for how much? What kind of return will be generated for taxpayers in such a depressed market? If sold at current price level, wouldn’t the long term windfall be reaped by just another set of private or foreign capital instead of benefiting taxpayers? (Witness the trouble AIG is having selling off its assets) There must be many other consequences we fail to imagine. Drs Krugman and Roubini may believe this process can be orderly undertaken in something like less than a year, I would tend to believe somebody like Bill Isaac, who has actually carried out the process, that it will drag on for years, and may prove disastrous. Even Dr. Krugman didn’t want the government owning the banks for an extended period of time either. We didn’t get into this mess overnight, and nationalization is not a theoretical magic bullet that will get us out overnight.

    3.Banks are not lending.
    As pointed out by Bill Gross of Pimco and others, what is ailing the credit market the most is not that the big banks are not lending because they are zombies, but the virtual collapse of the “shadow banking system” of securitization, which made up something like half of the credit market. Bank lending has not decreased dramatically. With increasing deposits and government encouragement and protection, the banks will increase lending. The administration is trying to revive the securitization sector with government assistance to make up for the shortfall. Maybe we should give the administration some time instead of being so quick to judgment based on ideological biases, which seems to be happening from both right and left at the moment.

    4.Ultimately, there are more than one way to skin a cat. Nationalization may be the political and ideological acceptable way to go in the current blame-seeking witch-hunting climate. With all its associated risks, one can’t say for certain it won’t work. However, let’s not pretend it is the intellectual superior solution to the problem, because it is not. Suspending mark-to-market to allow time for recovery, for example, seems to me would go hand in hand with the Keynesian approach of loosening money supply and increasing government spending we are adopting now. In both cases, we are engaging in something that could be abused and had helped to get us into this mess. Nonetheless, we can do it and try to reverse it in time when recovery is induced.

  47. trackerman says:

    Some pundits are claiming that if the Mark to Market rule is suspended (either temporarily or permanently), the financial stocks will bounce 2-3 times. How can the suspension of this rule change the fact that the financial company is near broke? Does it mean that they will look less broke? Does this mean C goes to $3.00 and BOC goes to $9 overnight?

  48. dunnage says:

    sailorwill: Hey, thanks for apologizing for the mess. I sure as hell had nothing t0 do with it and figured it couldn’t just be the banks.

    Nothing unusual about recessions. Unusual ain’t the sub-prime. But weird is leveraging the world at 100 to 1 based on the price of a house in Riverside, Ca. and a condo in Miami.

    And Weirder: the shadow bank. fix it? anybody seen it? hell, anybody seen the bank bank books? Do they keep books?

    And there will be no lending. Cash gifts and years of easing did not induce Japan’s money centers to lend. If they could lend nobody would be mentioning mark to market. Now their gonna say they are lending, but it is really cracked to be expecting them to lend a dime.

    There is not enough money, literally, to fix these dudes. Not the banks that bank, I mean the Money Centers: Paulsen knew who they were. Like, did he give billions to a bank in your neighborhood?

    There might be enough money but for all the money center banks in the world jumping on this one trick pony. Comic aside: Realize, these dolts sold this stuff to one another using math to turn turds into AAA. Endless variations resulting in endless commissions. And ThenThey Kept The Stuff. a lot anyway.

    So, why rush into anything? The Treasury is pure Wall Street and they don’t have a clue. We’ll keep dumping cash on them — Japan had 10 stimulus programs also — and only the shadow knows.

    If only Wall Street could do what the Government can: Burn the paper.

  49. Greg0658 says:

    sailorwill your point 1 is right on (the responsibility and all – shortly said MEW was widespread) drove our Bush2 years economy

    in 2 .. “There must be many other consequences we fail to imagine” ya I see it round here … real assets purchased . ie productive factories (then mothballed) & farms ( _____ )

  50. Bruce in Tn says:

    Speaking of Nationalization, have you noticed what the British did with Lloyds of London?

  51. karen,

    you’re hardly crazy, see: http://clusty.com/search?input-form=clusty-simple&v%3Asources=webplus&query=Dorothy+silver+slippers

    that wasn’t what I was alluding to, anyway..

    in my post I was thinking about yon’ Wizard of Oz/FBM, remindered your statement/Q, and, thus, was asking..

    this: Hugo Salinas Price, president of the Mexican Civic Association for Silver and the world’s foremost advocate of restoring silver’s role as a circulating currency, addressed GATA’s recent conference in Washington by video. His address, “Dorothy’s Silver Slippers,” detailed his proposal for the issuance of a circulating silver ounce coin for Mexico — a coin that, not being imprinted with any particular peso value, would never be at risk of withdrawal from circulation because its melt value had come to exceed its face value.
    http://www.gata.org/node/6254

    Salinas Price’s address to the GATA conference is 23 minutes long and you can find it in three parts at YouTube here:

    is pretty interesting..’Free Silver’ would be a huge step forward..

  52. Brilliant visual!!

  53. d4winds says:

    The cartoonists, like this one, and comedians, like Jon Stewart with his take on CNBC, are the only ones in the MSM with a lick of common sense. Great cartoon.