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	<title>Comments on: The Curse of Cheap Money</title>
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	<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/</link>
	<description>Macro Perspective on the Capital Markets, Economy, Geopolitics, Technology, and Digital Media</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 20:46:15 -0500</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Okrahouma</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192444</link>
		<dc:creator>Okrahouma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 21:40:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192444</guid>
		<description>Hello All, my first post. Really enjoyed the comments.

Seems like a key point is to recognize the enabling legislation for our current misery (the Federal Reserve Act). Along that line, note there really is a difference between money and credit. The graphic is labeled &quot;money&quot; where it should be recognized as (primarily) credit.

We do have access to cheap &quot;money&quot; in the form of circulating U.S. coinage which is spent into circulation interest free. There is no other &quot;money&quot;.  &quot;Federal Reserve Notes&quot; are not money, but circulating credit instruments that are not redeemable contracts as they fail to guarantee payment and as such are fiat &quot;legal tender instruments&quot; (which are none the less used as part of the Federal Reserve&#039;s &quot;monetary base&quot; for fractional reserve credit creation).

Until Nixon jilted the rest of the world by closing the &quot;Gold Window&quot; for satisfaction of international dollar debts in the 1970&#039;s, there has been no real money circulating in the U.S. per the Constitutional mandate for gold and silver coin (Art. 1 Sec. 10). Congress never had power to name legal tender other than gold and silver. All the money cases appearing to validate or &quot;legalize&quot; &quot;paper m0ney&quot; were settled in favor of &quot;paper money&quot; after the War Between the States as long as it was contractually and  easily redeemable in gold or silver (thus satisfying the Constitutional requirement).

If you want freedom and stable economy, enforce the Constitutional money system, where coinage circulates free and clear, no interest due. Stop paying the international banking cabal interest on every move you make. To make a small dent or statement, use more coinage (circulates interest free), fewer Federal Reserve Notes (frns) and less checking account credits (the existence of which evidence interest bearing loans at one level or another).

My Grandparents said, &quot;It&#039;s not what you make, it&#039;s what you keep.&quot; Never borrow money or create credit unless it can be employed to profit from real productive activity. This runaway system has seen a lot of technological advances prior to implosion, but the party is over. &quot;They&quot; probably supercharged it for the last big rake-off prior to the demographic change that dooms it ti deflation. As the Baby Boomers retire the producing class grows smaller, so naturally will not use as much money or credit, thus a smaller &quot;money&quot; system and falling prices

 ...unless you let enough immigrants in to take up the slack. 

Wait, wait, don&#039;t send the illegals home yet. We may need them if we can&#039;t force our government to obey the Constitution.

-Okrahouma</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello All, my first post. Really enjoyed the comments.</p>
<p>Seems like a key point is to recognize the enabling legislation for our current misery (the Federal Reserve Act). Along that line, note there really is a difference between money and credit. The graphic is labeled &#8220;money&#8221; where it should be recognized as (primarily) credit.</p>
<p>We do have access to cheap &#8220;money&#8221; in the form of circulating U.S. coinage which is spent into circulation interest free. There is no other &#8220;money&#8221;.  &#8220;Federal Reserve Notes&#8221; are not money, but circulating credit instruments that are not redeemable contracts as they fail to guarantee payment and as such are fiat &#8220;legal tender instruments&#8221; (which are none the less used as part of the Federal Reserve&#8217;s &#8220;monetary base&#8221; for fractional reserve credit creation).</p>
<p>Until Nixon jilted the rest of the world by closing the &#8220;Gold Window&#8221; for satisfaction of international dollar debts in the 1970&#8217;s, there has been no real money circulating in the U.S. per the Constitutional mandate for gold and silver coin (Art. 1 Sec. 10). Congress never had power to name legal tender other than gold and silver. All the money cases appearing to validate or &#8220;legalize&#8221; &#8220;paper m0ney&#8221; were settled in favor of &#8220;paper money&#8221; after the War Between the States as long as it was contractually and  easily redeemable in gold or silver (thus satisfying the Constitutional requirement).</p>
<p>If you want freedom and stable economy, enforce the Constitutional money system, where coinage circulates free and clear, no interest due. Stop paying the international banking cabal interest on every move you make. To make a small dent or statement, use more coinage (circulates interest free), fewer Federal Reserve Notes (frns) and less checking account credits (the existence of which evidence interest bearing loans at one level or another).</p>
<p>My Grandparents said, &#8220;It&#8217;s not what you make, it&#8217;s what you keep.&#8221; Never borrow money or create credit unless it can be employed to profit from real productive activity. This runaway system has seen a lot of technological advances prior to implosion, but the party is over. &#8220;They&#8221; probably supercharged it for the last big rake-off prior to the demographic change that dooms it ti deflation. As the Baby Boomers retire the producing class grows smaller, so naturally will not use as much money or credit, thus a smaller &#8220;money&#8221; system and falling prices</p>
<p> &#8230;unless you let enough immigrants in to take up the slack. </p>
<p>Wait, wait, don&#8217;t send the illegals home yet. We may need them if we can&#8217;t force our government to obey the Constitution.</p>
<p>-Okrahouma</p>
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		<title>By: patfla</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192412</link>
		<dc:creator>patfla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 18:25:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192412</guid>
		<description>Hi Barry - now that topics are getting so long, an outline view as well as ratings for individual posts - such as here on www.slashdot.org: http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/11/1650219/Behind-the-My-Location-Errors-In-Google-Maps - would be nice.

pat</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Barry &#8211; now that topics are getting so long, an outline view as well as ratings for individual posts &#8211; such as here on <a href="http://www.slashdot.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.slashdot.org</a>: <a href="http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/11/1650219/Behind-the-My-Location-Errors-In-Google-Maps" rel="nofollow">http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/11/1650219/Behind-the-My-Location-Errors-In-Google-Maps</a> &#8211; would be nice.</p>
<p>pat</p>
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		<title>By: Mark E Hoffer</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192411</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark E Hoffer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 18:17:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192411</guid>
		<description>Dogfish, 

Nice points.  especially, given the ascendency of the DLC, w/42, w/in the (D)-team..it&#039;s been all &#039;Neo-Cons&#039;, all the Time.

cv, 

you might be forgetting that Buchanan savaged 41 (&quot;King George&quot;) in the &#039;92 Primary..
see: http://clusty.com/search?input-form=clusty-simple&amp;v%3Asources=webplus&amp;query=Buchanan+1992+Republican+Primary+%22King+George%22
for starters..

and the, thereby, &#039;over-the-top&#039;/ &#039;Ultraconservative&#039; RNC, in Houston, &#039;turned off&#039; a lot of potential, &#039;softer&#039; voterz..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dogfish, </p>
<p>Nice points.  especially, given the ascendency of the DLC, w/42, w/in the (D)-team..it&#8217;s been all &#8216;Neo-Cons&#8217;, all the Time.</p>
<p>cv, </p>
<p>you might be forgetting that Buchanan savaged 41 (&#8221;King George&#8221;) in the &#8216;92 Primary..<br />
see: <a href="http://clusty.com/search?input-form=clusty-simple&amp;v%3Asources=webplus&amp;query=Buchanan+1992+Republican+Primary+%22King+George%22" rel="nofollow">http://clusty.com/search?input-form=clusty-simple&amp;v%3Asources=webplus&amp;query=Buchanan+1992+Republican+Primary+%22King+George%22</a><br />
for starters..</p>
<p>and the, thereby, &#8216;over-the-top&#8217;/ &#8216;Ultraconservative&#8217; RNC, in Houston, &#8216;turned off&#8217; a lot of potential, &#8217;softer&#8217; voterz..</p>
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		<title>By: Dogfish</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192376</link>
		<dc:creator>Dogfish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:19:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192376</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m sorry, but the &quot;media is biased to the left&quot; meme is just another talking point.  Some of the most influential neoconservative journalists work(ed) for the &quot;liberal&quot; NYT and WaPo.  If you define certain publications as &quot;left-wing&quot; or &quot;right-wing&quot; it sets the table for people to more easily dismiss those publications while simultaneously using their reporting to set boundaries for &quot;acceptable&quot; (ie, limiting) discussion.

There also seems to be little discussion of the elitist/populist divisions within each side of the left/right divide... which, to me, is more important at this point than the left/right thing, which I think of as a charade.  Because you have corporatistas/elitists in each party that are running the show (regardless of which side wins), while populists on either side of the aisle get marginalized.  This has helped mask the class warfare that has gone on in this country for decades, which we&#039;re seeing the results of now (Mass wealth depends upon mass consumption, mass consumption depends on people, ya know, being able to actually buy stuff..  see also: wage stagnation, trickle-down economics, globalization, &quot;free trade&quot; agreements, etc)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sorry, but the &#8220;media is biased to the left&#8221; meme is just another talking point.  Some of the most influential neoconservative journalists work(ed) for the &#8220;liberal&#8221; NYT and WaPo.  If you define certain publications as &#8220;left-wing&#8221; or &#8220;right-wing&#8221; it sets the table for people to more easily dismiss those publications while simultaneously using their reporting to set boundaries for &#8220;acceptable&#8221; (ie, limiting) discussion.</p>
<p>There also seems to be little discussion of the elitist/populist divisions within each side of the left/right divide&#8230; which, to me, is more important at this point than the left/right thing, which I think of as a charade.  Because you have corporatistas/elitists in each party that are running the show (regardless of which side wins), while populists on either side of the aisle get marginalized.  This has helped mask the class warfare that has gone on in this country for decades, which we&#8217;re seeing the results of now (Mass wealth depends upon mass consumption, mass consumption depends on people, ya know, being able to actually buy stuff..  see also: wage stagnation, trickle-down economics, globalization, &#8220;free trade&#8221; agreements, etc)</p>
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		<title>By: cvienne</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192364</link>
		<dc:creator>cvienne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:47:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192364</guid>
		<description>@mathman

&quot;The media did such a good job of giving him NO air time, talking negatively (as if their own personal record of work could even come close to what Nader’s done for the consumer - ALL OF US) about him, and not allowing him into ANY of the debates&quot;

---

I think you already know the answer to that one...PLEASE EVERYONE - DON&#039;T JUMP ON THIS AS A POLITICAL STATEMENT - I&#039;M MAKING A M-E-D-I-A STATEMENT...

The media is clearly biased to the left (save for FOX who are just a bunch of clowns)...

So when a 3 candidate system emerges (like 1992, with Perot), they study the polls...They thought Perot could siphon off enough votes from Bush 41 so they were happy to let him join the party...As it turns out, they got their wish, as Clinton was elected with the lowest percent of popular vote in history...

In 2008, they didn&#039;t NEED a Nader in the gumming up the springwerks...Obama had a clear advantage over McCain early on, plus momentum...So an effort was made to keep him out...

Where they screwed up was in 2000 &amp; 2004...I think they thought there was NO WAY &quot;W&quot; could win against either Gore or Kerry...

I&#039;m sure we can expect more of the same forevermore...Although I do believe that the internet is going to achieve a greater and greater dominance in formulating thought...The MSM will then go the way of the newspapers...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@mathman</p>
<p>&#8220;The media did such a good job of giving him NO air time, talking negatively (as if their own personal record of work could even come close to what Nader’s done for the consumer &#8211; ALL OF US) about him, and not allowing him into ANY of the debates&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8212;</p>
<p>I think you already know the answer to that one&#8230;PLEASE EVERYONE &#8211; DON&#8217;T JUMP ON THIS AS A POLITICAL STATEMENT &#8211; I&#8217;M MAKING A M-E-D-I-A STATEMENT&#8230;</p>
<p>The media is clearly biased to the left (save for FOX who are just a bunch of clowns)&#8230;</p>
<p>So when a 3 candidate system emerges (like 1992, with Perot), they study the polls&#8230;They thought Perot could siphon off enough votes from Bush 41 so they were happy to let him join the party&#8230;As it turns out, they got their wish, as Clinton was elected with the lowest percent of popular vote in history&#8230;</p>
<p>In 2008, they didn&#8217;t NEED a Nader in the gumming up the springwerks&#8230;Obama had a clear advantage over McCain early on, plus momentum&#8230;So an effort was made to keep him out&#8230;</p>
<p>Where they screwed up was in 2000 &amp; 2004&#8230;I think they thought there was NO WAY &#8220;W&#8221; could win against either Gore or Kerry&#8230;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure we can expect more of the same forevermore&#8230;Although I do believe that the internet is going to achieve a greater and greater dominance in formulating thought&#8230;The MSM will then go the way of the newspapers&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: mathman</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192346</link>
		<dc:creator>mathman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 15:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192346</guid>
		<description>If we&#039;re going to talk about politics and the failing thereof on all sides (the media, the lazy, ignorant majority of voters swayed by msm, and the bullshit politicians all about becoming or remaining &quot;lifelong politicians&quot;, switching parties at will, always for their benefit and ALL of this brought to you by CORPORATE AMERIKKKA) i have to at least put in a little shout out to Ralph Nader who i voted for in both of his previous tries (before Obama).  

This guy HAS A RECORD of fighting for the consumer, exposing fraud, speaking truth to power, being a bit charismatic (some say he looks like Lincoln) and STILL WORKING on overthrowing the established corporate takeover of our government.  The media did such a good job of giving him NO air time, talking negatively (as if their own personal record of work could even come close to what Nader&#039;s done for the consumer - ALL OF US) about him, and not allowing him into ANY of the debates that it&#039;s no wonder he didn&#039;t make a better showing.

i accept any an all opinions/comments as being just that (like my thoughts) and welcome debate/rebuttal, as i&#039;ve been reading this blog for a while and admire (but like you, don&#039;t always agree with) the lot of you here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If we&#8217;re going to talk about politics and the failing thereof on all sides (the media, the lazy, ignorant majority of voters swayed by msm, and the bullshit politicians all about becoming or remaining &#8220;lifelong politicians&#8221;, switching parties at will, always for their benefit and ALL of this brought to you by CORPORATE AMERIKKKA) i have to at least put in a little shout out to Ralph Nader who i voted for in both of his previous tries (before Obama).  </p>
<p>This guy HAS A RECORD of fighting for the consumer, exposing fraud, speaking truth to power, being a bit charismatic (some say he looks like Lincoln) and STILL WORKING on overthrowing the established corporate takeover of our government.  The media did such a good job of giving him NO air time, talking negatively (as if their own personal record of work could even come close to what Nader&#8217;s done for the consumer &#8211; ALL OF US) about him, and not allowing him into ANY of the debates that it&#8217;s no wonder he didn&#8217;t make a better showing.</p>
<p>i accept any an all opinions/comments as being just that (like my thoughts) and welcome debate/rebuttal, as i&#8217;ve been reading this blog for a while and admire (but like you, don&#8217;t always agree with) the lot of you here.</p>
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		<title>By: Dogfish</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192317</link>
		<dc:creator>Dogfish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 14:03:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192317</guid>
		<description>@ steve from va

The recent price history of oil has become detached from supply/demand and has in large part been driven up by speculators... as such, I&#039;m not sure we can glean much information regarding it&#039;s scarcity (or the concept of Peak Oil) from it&#039;s price.  Along the same lines, I would ask that you contemplate the possibility that many of the sources promoting the idea of peak oil and scarcity might be doing so with purpose of either artificially driving up the price, or convincing people of the (false) need to open of public lands for more drilling and exploration.

Kinda like all the Global Warming hoopla as an excuse to pass carbon taxes or create a new carbon trading market.  More carbon dioxide will just mean more plants.  If we really want to do something about the environment, it should be with regards to plastics (Great Pacific Vortex, anyone?), industrial pollution, and air/water quality (such as proper filtration of pharmaceuticals entering our water supply).  Unfortunately those problems don&#039;t allow the profit opportunities for business and government that Global Warming does...

Fear is a great way to misdirect people&#039;s energy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ steve from va</p>
<p>The recent price history of oil has become detached from supply/demand and has in large part been driven up by speculators&#8230; as such, I&#8217;m not sure we can glean much information regarding it&#8217;s scarcity (or the concept of Peak Oil) from it&#8217;s price.  Along the same lines, I would ask that you contemplate the possibility that many of the sources promoting the idea of peak oil and scarcity might be doing so with purpose of either artificially driving up the price, or convincing people of the (false) need to open of public lands for more drilling and exploration.</p>
<p>Kinda like all the Global Warming hoopla as an excuse to pass carbon taxes or create a new carbon trading market.  More carbon dioxide will just mean more plants.  If we really want to do something about the environment, it should be with regards to plastics (Great Pacific Vortex, anyone?), industrial pollution, and air/water quality (such as proper filtration of pharmaceuticals entering our water supply).  Unfortunately those problems don&#8217;t allow the profit opportunities for business and government that Global Warming does&#8230;</p>
<p>Fear is a great way to misdirect people&#8217;s energy.</p>
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		<title>By: alfred e</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192268</link>
		<dc:creator>alfred e</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 04:25:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192268</guid>
		<description>@steve: heavy.  but true.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@steve: heavy.  but true.</p>
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		<title>By: cvienne</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192256</link>
		<dc:creator>cvienne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 02:44:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192256</guid>
		<description>ahab

Dude...if your daughter is 11...come year 2014 you&#039;d better keep her away from the G-8 summitt if you&#039;re up to date with what&#039;s been going down in this thread...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ahab</p>
<p>Dude&#8230;if your daughter is 11&#8230;come year 2014 you&#8217;d better keep her away from the G-8 summitt if you&#8217;re up to date with what&#8217;s been going down in this thread&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: call me ahab</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/07/the-curse-of-cheap-money/comment-page-4/#comment-192249</link>
		<dc:creator>call me ahab</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 02:19:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=31836#comment-192249</guid>
		<description>dudes-

this is it-  back in my harley days- this song brings it out- I listen to this and I want to hit the road-
too bad my daughter is only 11- but damn this breaks my heart


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=725iONdAu9Q</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dudes-</p>
<p>this is it-  back in my harley days- this song brings it out- I listen to this and I want to hit the road-<br />
too bad my daughter is only 11- but damn this breaks my heart</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=725iONdAu9Q" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=725iONdAu9Q</a></p>
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