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	<title>Comments on: Subscription Based Music Services</title>
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	<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/</link>
	<description>Macro Perspective on the Capital Markets, Economy, Geopolitics, Technology, and Digital Media</description>
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		<title>By: mikaeel</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226633</link>
		<dc:creator>mikaeel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Oct 2009 18:05:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226633</guid>
		<description>On the streets of NYC they are selling bootleg CD&#039;s for $0.50 (fifty cents). The reason, many people are downloading songs for FREE. I have a friend with close to seven thousand songs on their Ipod. They didn&#039;t pay for a single one. How long do you expect people to pay for something that they can get for free. To top it off, much of this free music is easier to deal with than the stuff you have to pay for. Free, simpler and more convenient, V.S.  x dollars a month/download/per play.

What I can&#039;t understand is why would someone even start a business selling something people can get for free. But then again I drink tap water and avoid NYC&#039;s toll bridges.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the streets of NYC they are selling bootleg CD&#8217;s for $0.50 (fifty cents). The reason, many people are downloading songs for FREE. I have a friend with close to seven thousand songs on their Ipod. They didn&#8217;t pay for a single one. How long do you expect people to pay for something that they can get for free. To top it off, much of this free music is easier to deal with than the stuff you have to pay for. Free, simpler and more convenient, V.S.  x dollars a month/download/per play.</p>
<p>What I can&#8217;t understand is why would someone even start a business selling something people can get for free. But then again I drink tap water and avoid NYC&#8217;s toll bridges.</p>
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		<title>By: great king rat</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226450</link>
		<dc:creator>great king rat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Oct 2009 10:41:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226450</guid>
		<description>Grooveshark allows you to listen to any song on command, and its Autoplay does a solid job recommending songs.  It&#039;s my favorite site for streaming music.  Lala, Last.fm, and Pandora are good ones, too.  Amazon and Lala are my go-to places to buy mp3s.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Grooveshark allows you to listen to any song on command, and its Autoplay does a solid job recommending songs.  It&#8217;s my favorite site for streaming music.  Lala, Last.fm, and Pandora are good ones, too.  Amazon and Lala are my go-to places to buy mp3s.</p>
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		<title>By: vancouvergroover</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226249</link>
		<dc:creator>vancouvergroover</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 18:52:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226249</guid>
		<description>I have subscribed to the Napster service for a couple of years and love it.  Not only does it assuage my guilt for the many &quot;free&quot; downloads I have enjoyed but it allows me to quickly and easily find and listen to new music.  I find I don&#039;t have time to download entire albums just to give them a try.  

Often the gems aren&#039;t the singles the record companies have decided to promote.  I regularly fire up new releases, give them a listen and add tracks I like to my playlists.  Its surprising what you find when you avoid the RIAA herd.

I think there is an upgrade price which allows me to download music to my Ipod but I&#039;m not much of an Ipod guy as I&#039;m rarely more than a few feet from a computer.  I get way more sasisfaction from my monthly $10 to Napster than from my $XXX to the ^%$*^$ cable company.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have subscribed to the Napster service for a couple of years and love it.  Not only does it assuage my guilt for the many &#8220;free&#8221; downloads I have enjoyed but it allows me to quickly and easily find and listen to new music.  I find I don&#8217;t have time to download entire albums just to give them a try.  </p>
<p>Often the gems aren&#8217;t the singles the record companies have decided to promote.  I regularly fire up new releases, give them a listen and add tracks I like to my playlists.  Its surprising what you find when you avoid the RIAA herd.</p>
<p>I think there is an upgrade price which allows me to download music to my Ipod but I&#8217;m not much of an Ipod guy as I&#8217;m rarely more than a few feet from a computer.  I get way more sasisfaction from my monthly $10 to Napster than from my $XXX to the ^%$*^$ cable company.</p>
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		<title>By: ardano</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226179</link>
		<dc:creator>ardano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 16:51:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226179</guid>
		<description>I have used pandora and like it.  I have an ipod and a sansa.  However, I also still use cd&#039;s and listen to the radio.  ALL of these music systems have issues.  

Internet radio suffers from a dynamic range issue.  The music is not rich, same with satrad.  

Ipods suffer from a similar problem.  We live in a world where video is in HD.  Yet the new standard for audio is MP3, which is a lower standard than what&#039;s available on a cd.  This makes no sense.  I appreciate music.  I want to hear it...really hear it.  MP3 does not allow this.  There are better standards but they are not widely used.  I actually still buy and use my cd collection, transfer it without losing clarity to the puny little sansa and like that almost as much as the elegance of the Ipod.  

I don&#039;t see how any music service survives unless the price is lowered.  Peg these services below $10/month and I think they will take off.  However, we understand the industry will not allow this.  

HD has come to radio, but the costs to add hd are just now begining to come down in price and outside of major markets I don&#039;t know how many stations will use HD bands.  

The music industry is a mess and those of us who enjoy music are constantly frustrated.  How many times do I have to pay for a version of a song or album that i&#039;ve owned and enjoyed?  Why hasn&#039;t competition driven down the cost of a single download?  Why hasn&#039;t the industry realized that consumers want a standard for audio that keeps pace with what&#039;s happening in video?  

One last point.  My cable companies stream audio through several services.  Why would I pay for streaming radio when I could use these services.  I&#039;m already paying too much for cable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have used pandora and like it.  I have an ipod and a sansa.  However, I also still use cd&#8217;s and listen to the radio.  ALL of these music systems have issues.  </p>
<p>Internet radio suffers from a dynamic range issue.  The music is not rich, same with satrad.  </p>
<p>Ipods suffer from a similar problem.  We live in a world where video is in HD.  Yet the new standard for audio is MP3, which is a lower standard than what&#8217;s available on a cd.  This makes no sense.  I appreciate music.  I want to hear it&#8230;really hear it.  MP3 does not allow this.  There are better standards but they are not widely used.  I actually still buy and use my cd collection, transfer it without losing clarity to the puny little sansa and like that almost as much as the elegance of the Ipod.  </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t see how any music service survives unless the price is lowered.  Peg these services below $10/month and I think they will take off.  However, we understand the industry will not allow this.  </p>
<p>HD has come to radio, but the costs to add hd are just now begining to come down in price and outside of major markets I don&#8217;t know how many stations will use HD bands.  </p>
<p>The music industry is a mess and those of us who enjoy music are constantly frustrated.  How many times do I have to pay for a version of a song or album that i&#8217;ve owned and enjoyed?  Why hasn&#8217;t competition driven down the cost of a single download?  Why hasn&#8217;t the industry realized that consumers want a standard for audio that keeps pace with what&#8217;s happening in video?  </p>
<p>One last point.  My cable companies stream audio through several services.  Why would I pay for streaming radio when I could use these services.  I&#8217;m already paying too much for cable.</p>
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		<title>By: Uchicagoman</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226167</link>
		<dc:creator>Uchicagoman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 16:37:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226167</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m with Rhythm above.. .
I heavy music listener and I love Napster.  Although, I truly wish they could develop an damn iPhone app.

The whole idea should be to make it EASY.  
I used to download content back in the hey-day, I could get anything I wanted...but eventually it became to much of a damn hassle.

It is simply easier for me to pay a reasonable fee for nearly all the content I want to listen to, anytime/anywhere. I don&#039;t 
have to put crap on my ipod or computer or whatever (or worry about RIAA suing my ass).  
Anyhow, &gt;&gt;&gt; All I need is an internet connection. &lt;&lt;&lt;


It is sad these things don&#039;t catch on better.
  
I really don&#039;t see why content isn&#039;t pooled together in one big online service.  IMHO, content producing entities that resist only hurt themselves.   I know hard-core fans like to have their own collection, but like I said, it will be irrelevant soon, considering Internet connectivity.

BTW, Pandora is great, to a certain extent, but eventually it will play the same damn stuff too often.  

AND, I fucking hate iTunes Store.  Talk about a shit deal.  I&#039;d rather own a CD.  But I guess some suckers like it? 

Good luck!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m with Rhythm above.. .<br />
I heavy music listener and I love Napster.  Although, I truly wish they could develop an damn iPhone app.</p>
<p>The whole idea should be to make it EASY.<br />
I used to download content back in the hey-day, I could get anything I wanted&#8230;but eventually it became to much of a damn hassle.</p>
<p>It is simply easier for me to pay a reasonable fee for nearly all the content I want to listen to, anytime/anywhere. I don&#8217;t<br />
have to put crap on my ipod or computer or whatever (or worry about RIAA suing my ass).<br />
Anyhow, &gt;&gt;&gt; All I need is an internet connection. &lt;&lt;&lt;</p>
<p>It is sad these things don&#039;t catch on better.</p>
<p>I really don&#039;t see why content isn&#039;t pooled together in one big online service.  IMHO, content producing entities that resist only hurt themselves.   I know hard-core fans like to have their own collection, but like I said, it will be irrelevant soon, considering Internet connectivity.</p>
<p>BTW, Pandora is great, to a certain extent, but eventually it will play the same damn stuff too often.  </p>
<p>AND, I fucking hate iTunes Store.  Talk about a shit deal.  I&#039;d rather own a CD.  But I guess some suckers like it? </p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
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		<title>By: alfred e</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226098</link>
		<dc:creator>alfred e</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 14:58:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226098</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m surprised no one has mentioned mtvmusic.com.  Sure they do videos, and sure there&#039;s no &quot;download&quot;. 
But they do lots of what would be obscure very good performers.  &quot;Baby got no Draw&#039;rs&quot;.   And they actually do music.  Which MTV seems to have forgotten.  

Remember the good old days when a good musician could have a hit without a &quot;Hollywood&quot; overproduced 
video?  It was about the music stupid.  Tell me again why Madonna and Brittney are such superb musicians.

But you can capture everything someone chooses to &quot;deliver&quot; to your PC for free with the right software.  

It&#039;s still morphing.  

And I agree totally that the quality of most of the internet music really, really sucks.  It&#039;s as if they intentionally downgraded it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m surprised no one has mentioned mtvmusic.com.  Sure they do videos, and sure there&#8217;s no &#8220;download&#8221;.<br />
But they do lots of what would be obscure very good performers.  &#8220;Baby got no Draw&#8217;rs&#8221;.   And they actually do music.  Which MTV seems to have forgotten.  </p>
<p>Remember the good old days when a good musician could have a hit without a &#8220;Hollywood&#8221; overproduced<br />
video?  It was about the music stupid.  Tell me again why Madonna and Brittney are such superb musicians.</p>
<p>But you can capture everything someone chooses to &#8220;deliver&#8221; to your PC for free with the right software.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s still morphing.  </p>
<p>And I agree totally that the quality of most of the internet music really, really sucks.  It&#8217;s as if they intentionally downgraded it.</p>
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		<title>By: KellyD3</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226071</link>
		<dc:creator>KellyD3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 14:16:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226071</guid>
		<description>The nice thing about Rhapsody (and Napster) is that you can listen to albums or tracks before buying them (either on on your PC or a Using Rhapsody to-go device).  If you like what you hear, you can buy it.  A nice &quot;try before you buy&quot; feature. 
There are also appears to be software that records (into an MP3) and identifies streaming music (replay music from applian), or records protected music (tunebite) off these sites.  Applian has a FAQ entry on the legality at http://applian.com/legal.php</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The nice thing about Rhapsody (and Napster) is that you can listen to albums or tracks before buying them (either on on your PC or a Using Rhapsody to-go device).  If you like what you hear, you can buy it.  A nice &#8220;try before you buy&#8221; feature.<br />
There are also appears to be software that records (into an MP3) and identifies streaming music (replay music from applian), or records protected music (tunebite) off these sites.  Applian has a FAQ entry on the legality at <a href="http://applian.com/legal.php" rel="nofollow">http://applian.com/legal.php</a></p>
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		<title>By: jj2me</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226030</link>
		<dc:creator>jj2me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 12:26:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226030</guid>
		<description>The hot news in subscriptions services is what Microsoft is doing with their Zune Pass: $15/mo. for unlimited subscription music *plus* 10 free-to-own downloads/mo. of high-quality DRM-free MP3s.

How can they do this profitably, when Yahoo Music subscription service was unprofitable at similar rates *without* giving the free downloads?

If Microsoft actually pulls away some market share from Apple (the Zune HD has gotten stellar reviews, especially when combined with the Zune Pass subscription), then Apple may need to respond with their own subscription service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The hot news in subscriptions services is what Microsoft is doing with their Zune Pass: $15/mo. for unlimited subscription music *plus* 10 free-to-own downloads/mo. of high-quality DRM-free MP3s.</p>
<p>How can they do this profitably, when Yahoo Music subscription service was unprofitable at similar rates *without* giving the free downloads?</p>
<p>If Microsoft actually pulls away some market share from Apple (the Zune HD has gotten stellar reviews, especially when combined with the Zune Pass subscription), then Apple may need to respond with their own subscription service.</p>
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		<title>By: Basilisc</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-226017</link>
		<dc:creator>Basilisc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 11:09:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-226017</guid>
		<description>Several of those (Spotify, Pandora, Rhapsody at least - didn&#039;t try them all) wouldn&#039;t let me sign up because they detected from my IP address that I live in Switzerland. Guess I won&#039;t be using any of those services. Luckily I can buy things from iTunes, but that&#039;s because I gave them a credit card with a US address. 

Until the music industry learns to deal with the amazing  (but true!) fact that &lt;b&gt;there are roughly 6 billion people in the world who don&#039;t live in the US&lt;/b&gt;, their business model will continue to consist of little more than bitching, moaning, and blocking access.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Several of those (Spotify, Pandora, Rhapsody at least &#8211; didn&#8217;t try them all) wouldn&#8217;t let me sign up because they detected from my IP address that I live in Switzerland. Guess I won&#8217;t be using any of those services. Luckily I can buy things from iTunes, but that&#8217;s because I gave them a credit card with a US address. </p>
<p>Until the music industry learns to deal with the amazing  (but true!) fact that <b>there are roughly 6 billion people in the world who don&#8217;t live in the US</b>, their business model will continue to consist of little more than bitching, moaning, and blocking access.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Masnick</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/subscription-based-music-services/comment-page-1/#comment-225893</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Masnick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 10:33:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=41225#comment-225893</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.techdirt.com/blog.php?company=rdio&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;And Here Come Another Round Of Yawn-Inducing Music Subscription Services
from the too-little-control dept&lt;/a&gt;

Well here we go again. There have been numerous attempts at music subscription services, and none have really done all that well. While some people do love their Rhapsody or Napster accounts -- neither has been a runaway success, and both struggle to get much attention these days. Yet, so many entrepreneurs believe it&#039;s a holy grail. So, here we go again. With plenty of people waiting for Spotify to enter the US market, the NY Times reports on two other new entrants; one from Mog -- who seems to have blasted press releases to everyone, with the general reaction being a big yawn and one from the founders of Kazaa and Skype, called Rdio. Neither sounds particularly compelling.

The problem with all of these subscription services is that they inherently need to have limits. You have to keep paying, you can&#039;t really share music with others, you may be able to take some of your music on the go, but it&#039;s usually a convoluted process. And that&#039;s a problem. Because people understand how mp3s work -- and that&#039;s without restrictions. Trying to get people to pay for a music experience with restrictions, that offers less than what they know can be done, is a recipe for failure. It&#039;s time to stop thinking of trying to &quot;sell music&quot; and start realizing how you can use music to sell something better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.techdirt.com/blog.php?company=rdio" rel="nofollow">And Here Come Another Round Of Yawn-Inducing Music Subscription Services<br />
from the too-little-control dept</a></p>
<p>Well here we go again. There have been numerous attempts at music subscription services, and none have really done all that well. While some people do love their Rhapsody or Napster accounts &#8212; neither has been a runaway success, and both struggle to get much attention these days. Yet, so many entrepreneurs believe it&#8217;s a holy grail. So, here we go again. With plenty of people waiting for Spotify to enter the US market, the NY Times reports on two other new entrants; one from Mog &#8212; who seems to have blasted press releases to everyone, with the general reaction being a big yawn and one from the founders of Kazaa and Skype, called Rdio. Neither sounds particularly compelling.</p>
<p>The problem with all of these subscription services is that they inherently need to have limits. You have to keep paying, you can&#8217;t really share music with others, you may be able to take some of your music on the go, but it&#8217;s usually a convoluted process. And that&#8217;s a problem. Because people understand how mp3s work &#8212; and that&#8217;s without restrictions. Trying to get people to pay for a music experience with restrictions, that offers less than what they know can be done, is a recipe for failure. It&#8217;s time to stop thinking of trying to &#8220;sell music&#8221; and start realizing how you can use music to sell something better.</p>
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