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	<title>Comments on: The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History</title>
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	<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/</link>
	<description>Macro Perspective on the Capital Markets, Economy, Geopolitics, Technology, and Digital Media</description>
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		<title>By: Buoyant Market &#124; The Big Picture</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-225175</link>
		<dc:creator>Buoyant Market &#124; The Big Picture</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Oct 2009 16:01:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-225175</guid>
		<description>[...] The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History (October 8th, 2009) http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/   PERMALINK [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History (October 8th, 2009) <a href="http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/" rel="nofollow">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/</a>   PERMALINK [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Case For An 11,500 Dow &#8211; And Going Long On Gold &#171; AGORACOM Blog</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224724</link>
		<dc:creator>The Case For An 11,500 Dow &#8211; And Going Long On Gold &#171; AGORACOM Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Oct 2009 02:01:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224724</guid>
		<description>[...] are in a secular bear market but sees the current rallying continuing until as high as 11,500.  In a must read post, he discusses the key factors that have been contributing to, and may continue adding to, the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] are in a secular bear market but sees the current rallying continuing until as high as 11,500.  In a must read post, he discusses the key factors that have been contributing to, and may continue adding to, the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: [Commodities] &#34;The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History&#34; - Big Mike Trading Forum</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224405</link>
		<dc:creator>[Commodities] &#34;The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History&#34; - Big Mike Trading Forum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Oct 2009 16:40:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224405</guid>
		<description>[...] &quot;The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History&quot;      Found this article 2 days ago and its worth a read. They compared 29 past Bear Markets and its (chart technical) behavior.  Original Source and full article: The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History &#124; The Big Picture [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &quot;The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History&quot;      Found this article 2 days ago and its worth a read. They compared 29 past Bear Markets and its (chart technical) behavior.  Original Source and full article: The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History | The Big Picture [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Are Stocks Fully Valued? &#124; The Big Picture</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224364</link>
		<dc:creator>Are Stocks Fully Valued? &#124; The Big Picture</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Oct 2009 13:14:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224364</guid>
		<description>[...] The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History (October 8th, 2009) http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History (October 8th, 2009) <a href="http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/" rel="nofollow">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: El-Erian Reiterates Skeptical Views As Stocks Grind Higher &#171; naked capitalism</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224347</link>
		<dc:creator>El-Erian Reiterates Skeptical Views As Stocks Grind Higher &#171; naked capitalism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Oct 2009 06:27:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224347</guid>
		<description>[...] Funds Are at Cash Levels Not Seen Since the 2007 Market Top. But Barry Ritholtz argues in &#8220;The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History,&#8221; that the fact that so many are skeptical means the equity rally has further to [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Funds Are at Cash Levels Not Seen Since the 2007 Market Top. But Barry Ritholtz argues in &#8220;The Most Hated Rally in Wall Street History,&#8221; that the fact that so many are skeptical means the equity rally has further to [...]</p>
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		<title>By: A little more on the market &#171; Mercury Rising 鳯女</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224275</link>
		<dc:creator>A little more on the market &#171; Mercury Rising 鳯女</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 21:30:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224275</guid>
		<description>[...] by Charles II on October 9, 2009  Barry Ritholtz thinks that the market will not correct&#8230; yet. He says typically it happens at 17 months [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] by Charles II on October 9, 2009  Barry Ritholtz thinks that the market will not correct&#8230; yet. He says typically it happens at 17 months [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Weekly Recap &#38; Outlook - 10.09.09 &#171; Obvious Insights</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224242</link>
		<dc:creator>Weekly Recap &#38; Outlook - 10.09.09 &#171; Obvious Insights</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 19:37:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224242</guid>
		<description>[...] AMI Investment Management,&#8221; who essentially tries to talk the market out of its rally.  As Barry pointed out, rallies don&#8217;t end because/when they&#8217;re hated; they end when they&#8217;re [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] AMI Investment Management,&#8221; who essentially tries to talk the market out of its rally.  As Barry pointed out, rallies don&#8217;t end because/when they&#8217;re hated; they end when they&#8217;re [...]</p>
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		<title>By: hbl</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224227</link>
		<dc:creator>hbl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 19:14:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224227</guid>
		<description>Barry said: &lt;i&gt;&quot;What Earnings were stocks tracking in 1998-99? How about 2002? How about 2006-08?&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Even though it was a rhetorical question, here are the answers since I looked:

1998-1999: 23x-30x range, then P/E ratio FELL when stocks sold off

2002: 17x-20x range, and stayed close to there (moving down to 15x in following years)

2006-2008: 15x-18x range, then P/E ratio ROSE slightly when stocks sold off

&lt;i&gt;&quot;Its pretty clear that markets can and do move independent of earnings.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Agreed. But it makes no sense to me to imply that it was a panicky reaction to look at falling earnings as a reason to sell stocks rather than live with the alternative of a skyrocketing P/E, especially in the context of an &lt;a href=&quot;http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_FM71j6-VkNE/SeixCMqq9aI/AAAAAAAAB_E/2WeE6OLuZsM/s1600-h/profitstogdp.jpg&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;unprecedented earnings bubble&lt;/a&gt; around 2006-2007, which left little justification for earnings to &quot;bounce back&quot; rapidly once the panic cleared.

There were definitely many panicked sellers, but I think for every seller there was a non-panicked buyer willing to pay what they considered a fair multiple of earnings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barry said: <i>&#8220;What Earnings were stocks tracking in 1998-99? How about 2002? How about 2006-08?&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Even though it was a rhetorical question, here are the answers since I looked:</p>
<p>1998-1999: 23x-30x range, then P/E ratio FELL when stocks sold off</p>
<p>2002: 17x-20x range, and stayed close to there (moving down to 15x in following years)</p>
<p>2006-2008: 15x-18x range, then P/E ratio ROSE slightly when stocks sold off</p>
<p><i>&#8220;Its pretty clear that markets can and do move independent of earnings.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Agreed. But it makes no sense to me to imply that it was a panicky reaction to look at falling earnings as a reason to sell stocks rather than live with the alternative of a skyrocketing P/E, especially in the context of an <a href="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_FM71j6-VkNE/SeixCMqq9aI/AAAAAAAAB_E/2WeE6OLuZsM/s1600-h/profitstogdp.jpg" rel="nofollow">unprecedented earnings bubble</a> around 2006-2007, which left little justification for earnings to &#8220;bounce back&#8221; rapidly once the panic cleared.</p>
<p>There were definitely many panicked sellers, but I think for every seller there was a non-panicked buyer willing to pay what they considered a fair multiple of earnings.</p>
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		<title>By: flipspiceland</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224028</link>
		<dc:creator>flipspiceland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 13:58:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224028</guid>
		<description>@rc

In a rational world you would be right.

However Reason deserted the quants and, with the imagination of Ponzi, and his disciples at the 5 IBs, the  &quot;Master&#039;s of the Universe &quot;,  inventing 100x derivatives that idiots gambled on with trillions of dollars of zirp loans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@rc</p>
<p>In a rational world you would be right.</p>
<p>However Reason deserted the quants and, with the imagination of Ponzi, and his disciples at the 5 IBs, the  &#8220;Master&#8217;s of the Universe &#8220;,  inventing 100x derivatives that idiots gambled on with trillions of dollars of zirp loans.</p>
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		<title>By: At S&#38;P 1065, a little more patience doesn't cost much - Steve Cook on Disciplined Investing - InvestorsInsight.com &#124; Financial Intelligence, Advice &#38; Research / Investment Strategies &#38; Planning for Individual Investors.</title>
		<link>http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/comment-page-2/#comment-224018</link>
		<dc:creator>At S&#38;P 1065, a little more patience doesn't cost much - Steve Cook on Disciplined Investing - InvestorsInsight.com &#124; Financial Intelligence, Advice &#38; Research / Investment Strategies &#38; Planning for Individual Investors.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 13:30:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/?p=40518#comment-224018</guid>
		<description>[...] A great must read piece by Barry Ridholtz on this rally (short):&#160;&#160;&#160; http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/&#160;&#160; Fundamental&#160;&#160;&#160; &#160;&#160;&#160; This is a really great article on [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] A great must read piece by Barry Ridholtz on this rally (short):&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/&nbsp;&#038;nbsp" rel="nofollow">http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/the-most-hated-rally-in-wall-street-history/&nbsp;&#038;nbsp</a>; Fundamental&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; This is a really great article on [...]</p>
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