To some degree, the productivity improvements from international trade are actually a statistical anomaly, so the boat is actually not as efficient as once thought, just more brutal.

why care anymore now than in those days ?!?!?!?

Over the next decade, the 55+ crowd will do everything to keep that money but they’ll be finding out that it does not buy much.

“Shirky’s conclusion” .. interesting jump into tribal hierarchy …. “for the same reasons stop-and-go traffic occurs on busy roads” .. I’ve gotta plan (like to get rich with*) 4lane supercity feeds .. rightmost (exit side) goes speedlimit and under, next lane to the left 5mph more, next 5mph above that, next lane what the flow can handle .. all moderated with electronic signs and sensors telling folks what the lane is actually doing .. so folks can find the lane that fits their grandma / nascar style instead of searching (weaving) for the best fit …. having laid out the plan .. another one of those “good luck with that”(said with a smile)

“a problem when something like 75-80% of the wealth is in the hands of the 55+” .. imo that IS THE Big Problem .. *those are just numbers an illusion a fantasy* said in the voice of Prof Falken War Games .. the kids** are indentured to fill that fantasy and there we are full circle (with this weekends fyi back&forths)(again)

* blew it didn’t I .. (not patented) on this high profile TBP

** the kids know its all backwards (thank the www & media) .. the Greatest Generation fought a couple world wars, came home to the primary standing factory base, created a bunch of kids to restock the world (as well as the rest world doing the same) and the greatest cap’ism story was spun into hyper-drive (3bil to 6bil in my 51yo lifetime)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WarGames
anda shameless plug of my mindset:
http://www.graphicsplus.info/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/future_now_8x10a200.jpg
Happy 40th Sesame Street .. me a mix of Oscar the grouch and Kermit the director

and those loop holes were mostly created to help TPTB. or to feed an industry (tax breaks for housing any one?)

and why are so fixated on taxes when its the incomes that have been collapsing? if they had kept up (as they had been for decades) nobody would be so concerned as they are now. its probably TPTB as they can misdirect the masses again to point at some thing other than them selves as being the culprit?

Who’s going to pay these taxes? Seems to me like it will be the young workers, not the retirees. This becomes a problem when something like 75-80% of the wealth is in the hands of the 55+.

You bring up a good point which is defining the keey elements that need to be addressed but if you are looking for a redistribution of wealth, I doubt taxes will do the trick. It seems to me that the rich always manage to avoid taxes. There are always loopholes or new derivatives to skirt the problem.

I think the US needs to decide which areas are vital and keep on funding them with treasuries as along as they possibly can. At one point Americans will be fnding their own projects as the rich will be buying up the bonds. If rates are low and inflation is triggered, they will lose money on these bonds and money will have easily been transftered to the younger generation.

“Those at the top would not, and seeing as they have all the money and the power, this will not happen ever. It would require another violent revolution with the winners not being corrupted by their own flaws and biases, which is quite impossible.”

So true diggidy, TPTB have a huge stake in keeping the status quo. And the second part, we’ve seen it over and over in human history, the new boss is the same as the old boss.

i accept Shirky’s conclusion:

Given the ubiquity of power law distributions, asking whether there is inequality in the weblog world (or indeed almost any social system) is the wrong question, since the answer will always be yes. The question to ask is “Is the inequality fair?

It is. Inequality occurs in large and unconstrained social systems for the same reasons stop-and-go traffic occurs on busy roads, not because it is anyone’s goal, but because it is a reliable property that emerges from the normal functioning of the system.

and i’m also sure the world doesn’t neatly fit into power laws distributions either.

“taxes more based upon:
use, consumption, speculation,” … meaning some form of sales tax and a trade tax

“and to a lesser extent,
wealth transfer as opposed to income and property” … meaning direct draws from the paycheck to Kansas City and the property taxes to the county complex

KISS principle
favor property tax for: maintain safety inside the county region: The National Guard*, roads, bridges, dams, water supply, sewers, police, fire, ambulance … helped with sales taxes from the gas pumps and electrical grid

income taxes: agree on the “lesser extent” because these are getting hard to police with underground economies and special cherry designed laws & regulations (thank the Lobbies) and seems the commonfolk or the galley slaves are the shackled (good luck .. this take is the easiest for the bureauocracy in power)

sales taxes: on luxury goods at a higher % / necessities at a low rate

trading taxes: I’m on board for this tax .. I think it would restore sanity .. the markets have become an industry all of its own .. I need to use words that TBP doesn’t let me use ..but the business world needs cash and going public is a mechanism for that cash injection .. that game needs metrics then the metrics and the game spin into one of those no use words

movies over and this stuff ain’t supposed to be in my job description .. but

* when the USA takes over the NatGuard for foreign wars .. correct appropriations are made to the county and businesses for losses (equipment, wages, lives, disabling) …. when I put property taxes on the hook for national defense I sort of meant the Pentagon budget too (so maybe The Pentagon should be broke up into 50 mini Pentagons)

“it’s funny when we talk about all men are created equal, and rugged individualism at the same time. we’re not created equal, biologically impossible. and rugged individualism is great, if you were born with a great mind, good looks, or great strength. in a meritocracy, there is someone at the bottom. lets hope that’s not you or your family.

i like ideals too, like capitalism and our form of government, but i don’t think the real world fit neatly into those ideals.”

Truly, there can be no perfect answer, but there can certainly be a better answer. To end with the quote that bedan this: THE RISING TIDE LIFTS ALL SHIPS

If we come up with a more efficient, fair, and better way as a whole, and eliminate much of the positive feedback loops that throw the system out of whack, it is my belief that those in the meritocracy at the bottom and the middle would still be better off as a whole. Those at the top would not, and seeing as they have all the money and the power, this will not happen ever. It would require another violent revolution with the winners not being corrupted by their own flaws and biases, which is quite impossible. The government we got is better than most, and we’ll be dead before the collapse or revolution anyway.